Arsenal by definition, have always represented the very best of British. We are diverse and multi-cultural, welcoming players and supporters from every corner of the world, whilst retaining a class that no amount of money can buy. Essentially, Arsenal are aristocrats through their assorted share-holders, many of them titled, and extremely wealthy.
Supporters too, particularly Brits, are very generous in spirit, willingly sacrificing their undying loyalty, and asking for little in return. Watching the Women’s Euro’s, after Germany had beaten Norway to claim their sixth successive Euro title, Guy Mowbray came out with a line that immediately reminded me of Arsenal – “Norway wanted it, Germany demanded it…” A strong aggressive powerful message of intent mixed with an arrogant confidence, the Germans are drilled to succeed. Arsenal are like Norway, they want it, but they don’t demand it. The most successful clubs demand a regular supply of silver-ware, and are quick to act if that supply dries up. Arsenal behave as if they don’t expect any silver-ware, but should any accidently turn up they can award themselves even bigger bonuses (not to say they don’t already, isn’t that so, Mr Gazidis?).
It’s nine years since Arsenal won the title, and despite making much noise between 2004 and now, they haven’t really had the stomach to go for it. It’s our sixteenth successive year of CL football, but we’ve only been to one final and two semi-finals, and as with the Premier League, we really are a long way from the quality needed to challenge, and a lot further away than we were in 2004.
The financial debate is pointless. We are forever turning up in the top four/five of Forbes and Deloittes richest global sports clubs, which can’t be a coincidence. Chelsea and Manchester City haven’t suddenly become bigger and wealthier than Arsenal, they are just prepared to invest whatever it takes to make their brand a winning one, which will in turn reap huge financial benefits from commercial and sponsorship revenues.
Arsenal are over-cautious with their short-term no risk approach, the philosophy is mirrored by the product on the field, everything at Arsenal is done with the hand-brake on. As if any proof of this were needed, Arsenal had more possession of the ball than any other side in the PL. Possession for possession sake. That isn’t a money issue, that’s flawed football. That’s having far too much of the ball and half the time not having a clue what to do with it having passed themselves into blind alleys and cul-de-sacs that lead nowhere.
We are in a place now where we go into every game against the top three hoping for divine intervention, but deep down fearing defeat.
Is that really who we’ve become?
Maybe it’s part of the French DNA, that in the final analysis, they don’t have the blood and guts for the battle. They’re philosophers rather than fighters, which is why they virtually laid out the red carpet for the Germans in WWII.
I stand by my conviction that Arsene Wenger has refused to test himself at the elite level. People like to cite his loyalty and love for Arsenal, but my guess is that had he moved to a big club and failed, his career would have been quite short. And who else would renumerate a manager as generously as Arsenal do for achieving the bare minimum?
Arsenal supporters are very generous in spirit, they are fiercely loyal and very forgiving in nature. We never demand trophies, NOR do we demand ridiculously expensive big-money signings, but we do expect our tactical frailties to be addressed and fixed, and I personally expect the level of quality in our players to be of the standard required to take the title to the wire, and seriously challenge in the CL, just as was promised seven years ago by our club’s hierarchy.
Arsene Wenger arrived fresh-faced from Japan, full of life, full of ideas to revolutionise Arsenal and English football. Wenger cleverly utilised the French market at a time when the French football was in the ascendancy, and building around Dennis Bergkamp he discovered the perfect mix. But just as French football declined so too have Arsenal. The last transfer that excited me a little was in January 2004, when Arsenal signed Jose Antonio Reyes, and even then only because the British Press – as always when these things happen – were a little too lavish in their appraisal of the Spaniard.
Since that time, in my opinion, Arsene Wenger’s judgement and use of the club’s resources has been poor, without any clear indication of improvement. How many times do we give the benefit of the doubt, hoping to see a dynamic change, something exciting happen, only to be left feeling deflated again? Arsene Wenger gave Arsenal fans back their belief, and he made us fall in love with football again, but that was a long time ago. And it doesn’t matter what the excuse or reason is, Arsene Wenger has nothing new or revolutionary to bring to the table, and his best days probably left along with David Dein. This isn’t an anti-Wenger campaign, this is a pro-Arsenal thing, and an honest opinion of where I think we’re at.
In six years time, we’ll be celebrating 100 years of unbroken football in the top flight (save for WWII), wouldn’t it be great going into that season knowing that we’re back as a genuine force! There are a lot of changes needed at Arsenal if that is to be so,
I only hope those charged with making that happen are brave and intelligent enough to make the right decisions for the club and it’s supporters.
Written by We are The Arsenal
Arsenal News 24/7
arsenalarsenal.net 
“Chelsea and Manchester City haven’t suddenly become bigger and wealthier than Arsenal”
Errr…..yes they did, certainly financially anyway, and your whole argument falls on its face because of your failure or refusal to understand this.
Negative article? As a blogger you have a chance to support your club! Wenger needs to preserve his dignity and train the team. We the fans need to do the PR work in the media, regardless of what we think of the management. Now is the time for unity! COYG!!!Keep up the pressure!
Morning all
We on this site pride ourselves that all opinions are welcome and while the constant negativity from some is annoying it has to be pointed out that the heads in the sand positivity from others can also be annoying.
The author of this post is a passionate Arsenal supporter, as we all are, otherwise we wouldn’t bother to frequent the blogs. If you don’t agree with his opinions then you have the right to say so but not to mount a campaign of bullying because you know that there are others that agree with you.
The club can’t be doing everything right at the moment as we are pretty divided about whether Suarez should be a target for our club let alone a stand out £40m to £50m purchase.
So before you lay into WaTH for his opinions about the club think about how you feel about Suarez ……… I for one think it’s a ridiculous decision by the club to be thinking about bringing a man like Suarez to our team but hey ho ………………….
There’s certainly a lot to agree with in your piece, barring what LB has pointed out.
I do think the board are living in the past & think it would be of benefit
to have some younger more ambitious board members.
As for Wenger I have always supported him & felt he has not been allowed to spend & buy who he would like but I must admit if we don’t buy some players & have the same sort of season as last year , I think its time for him to step aside.
What a pompous self important drivel. Just accept you know next to nothing about running a football club, go to a game, enjoy it and have a few beers with some mates afterwards. Pontificate all you want in the pub but leave it there, don’t put it online.
Beautiful article! Am sure the Boss is very well aware of the situation, and he’ll do just about anything, to save his head…
While there is obviously much to disagree upon in the footballing context, that is pretty much a closed loop by now, so I’ll pick on this
“Maybe it’s part of the French DNA, that in the final analysis, they don’t have the blood and guts for the battle. They’re philosophers rather than fighters, which is why they virtually laid out the red carpet for the Germans in WWII”
So nothing to do with a contiguous border with Germany and Italy then? Britain’s success in resisting the Germans had nothing at all to do with Britain being an island? The economy of the two countries has no bearing? Context makes all the difference. Having half baked truths like French DNA or a Forbes rich list don’t make your arguments more logical.
While there is a crude cliche about opinions, I prefer the one which says
“Any clod can have the facts, but having opinions is an art.”
I also like these quotations
“You are not entitled to your opinion. You are entitled to your informed opinion. No one is entitled to be ignorant.”
― Harlan Ellison
“Most people are other people. Their thoughts are someone else’s opinions, their lives a mimicry, their passions a quotation.”
― Oscar Wilde
Especially the last, because my use of it is self deprecating right now 🙂
Morning Peaches
Who has been bullying the poor lamb? Name, names.
I don’t know, but there’s something so enigmatic about this Arsenal FC. But I know it somewhere that we’ll make a marquee signing this time, and we’ll be title contenders again.
And by the way, Brit or not, giving loyalty to Arsenal is not a sacrifice.
There’s having an opinion and then there’s writing utter rubbish.
It’s our duty to help the author become a better person by pointing out the utter stupidity of some his comments so he can learn how express his opinion in a reasoned manner.
I think that you have many poignant and valid things to say. I agree that the drive behind transfer dealings and pushing the club forward left with David Dein. We need to appoint a director of football (like DD) who has modern ideas and can negotiate to a swift end in the transfer market. These are indeed worrying times at Arsenal, and the mere fact that we have shipped out 20+ bodies is alarming. However, like every true Arsenal fan I hope that the situation will be resolved – hopefully via some astute high profile signings and some stability all round. AW transformed not only our club when he arrived, but English football as a whole. Has he had his day? Maybe, but after all the years of having no money I think he at least deserves one shot at spending and proving the doubters wrong.
I would request you to send this one to “Mr. Know all” aka Mr. Wenger. I have continually encouraged more gunners to come up and voice there concerns in the open but each time they equally disappoint just like their trusted Manager and the Senile board! Be4 the scrapping for a top 4 finish, the clarion call was that once we get it, our next objective was to strengthen immediately for the season to come. That was ok by me, then teams started to add players and they we were convinced that the window was not yet open! Well it opened and now the tune has changed into waiting towards close of the window. Now my question is, Arsenal has a manager and a CEO who are one of the most highest paid in their jobs and so who amongst them is not taking his work seriously? and what are fans doing to enable the club to move a head and atleast begin challenging for trophies?
Is it the board that buys the rubbish players we’ve had for the last 5/6 years? Is it the board that can’t defend free kicks? Is it the board that can’t score from set plays? Is it the board that plays nearly every new signing out of position? Is it the board that only ever gets out of the dug out to moan at the 4th official instead of encouraging the players? Is it the board that throws his water bottle around like a spoilt child while his young players look to him for direction? Is it the board who finds time away from his rubbish squad to have an affair in France? Is it the board that is petulant that they never give the opposition credit in interviews? Is it the board that decides to pay rubbish players so much on long contracts that we can’t shift the deadwood? In Arsene we rust! Wenger Out!
WATA,
Reading your article, I was impressed with the way you marshalled and presented your thoughts so that your direction and passion came through.
I also immediately realised, without knowing the author, that it was you, because the constant theme of your previous comments was again there for all to see, and no one can fault you for the consistency of your opinions.
Not wishing to prejudge the essay, I fully read it first throughout with interest, but sadly, unlike Shard, I found it was heavy with innuendo and conjecture and light on facts, and the mention of the French in a disparaging way might be termed unintentionally racist.
I do not for a moment doubt the integrity with which you write, or wish to deny you the right to an opinion, but what is lacking most in this article is balance.
Nothing in life is perfect, neither is everything totally bad, although there are exceptions that could be cited.
Arsenal and its management are not perfect, and despite your comments, no one can claim they are totally bad either.
For example, I wrote recently about the club’s management being heavily committed in their recent charitable endeavours and its community work, surely that balances the scales a little, even if you can find nothing that deserves your satisfaction on the football side?
You must have balance to give your opinions validity.
The title makes a play on Arsenal living in the past, rather than the ‘future now’ — which is a contradiction in terms, of course.
Nevertheless, you have written almost the whole article looking back at the past and what is singularly missing is any suggestions or proposals as to how Arsenal should address these perceived failings you see, and how they would impact on the future conduct or success of the club.
I really wanted to say something positive about the content of your Post, but I found that very difficult, and instead I thought the best courtesy I could do you was to respond honestly and analytically so that any further Posts might bear in mind some of the points raised above and better help convey your deeply held views on Arsenal and its management.
Sorry, WATA — the Post and the effort that went into it was good, the content was not. 😦
EIE
Well you couldn’t possibly call all our signings rubbish (Santi, BFG, Poldi and Arteta are all world class players and even Gerv was a full international with world cup experience
Also, all our goals against Napoli were from set pieces and I’m sure you’re not in a relationship so you couldn’t think anyone should have a private life.
But then maybe we really rust in Arsene, but you’re obviously too stupid to realise that we have a great long term model.
“In stupid “fans” we rust!”
That’s a clever line Jamie, I like that.
Well done, WATH, for taking the time to write a post – you obviously care about the club, and you believe what you write.
I just happen to disagree with pretty much every word! I won’t get into one of my incredibly wordy diatribes, but suffice to say that everything at Arsenal needs to be judged in context. And the context is THERE WAS NO MONEY (apologies for shouty caps, very rude, I know). In that context, what Wenger has achieved since the stadium project began, while being outspent not just by the Abu Dhabi Government and a thief who stole billions from the Russian people, but also by Stoke City and Sunderland and Aston Villa etc, is nothing short of remarkable. The last period of time, for all the ingratitude of many Arsenal fans, is Wenger’s crowning achievement. And I say that as someone who has travelled the country and round Europe following my club for +30 years, knowing all the highs and lows in those years.
The only other observation I’d make on your post is on the item that Shard referenced, the bit of cod-anthropology you get into with your recycling of the “French are surrender monkeys” line. It is a funny line, of course, and I’m not above teasing my French friends with it, but imputing cowardice and unreliability to a nation of 65 million people based on an ‘Allo ‘Allo cliche is ridiculous. You should bear in mind, for example, that France lost many, many more soldiers and civilians in World War One (also fought, in part, on their territory) than Britain did, and we (or rather, our forebears) lost a traumatically large number ourselves. The memory and trauma in France of that experience of the wholesale slaughter of young Frenchmen had more than a little to do with the way they split in World War Two, into those who wanted to appease the Nazis and those who wanted to resist.
Sorry to get fussy, but it is a pretty silly point to have made.
LB
Gud presentation & more of this. Dnt giv in to those hypocritical, all-knowin n blind fans like their wicked n stingy hero wenger. They should bury their heads in shame 4 publicly defendin failures.
Herb.
I rely on facts to determine the authenticity of what I read, and take that it consideration when judging the article’s worthiness.
The end of your 1st paragraph reads-
“Essentially. Arsenal are aristocrats through their assorted share-
holders, many of them titled, and extremely wealthy.”
Arsenal’s major shareholders are Stanley Kronke 66.83% and Alisher Usmanov 29.99%.
Are they Russian and American aristocracy? Or do we find the extremely wealthy aristocrats among the remaining 3.18% of the shareholders – which includes the Arsenal Supporters Trust?
This is the your 1st sentence in the 2nd paragraph.
“Supporters too, particularly Brits, are very generous in spirit, willingly sacrificing their undying loyalty, and asking for little in return”
Just how do you begin to know if this is in any way factual?
Herb,
Unlike yourself I will not go on and on and on endlessly about what I think of your article – suffice to say it is full of incorrect “facts” and full of insults, slurs and meaningless statements that fulfill your jaundiced view of everything Arsenal.
Have a good day AA bloggers I’m signing off until tomorrow.
26may
Was their no money when Wenger sold Petit, Overmars and Anelka
Please let’s not get into the whole AKB versus Get Wenger Out thing right now…. that one will run and run. I think the main complaint is not what was said but how it was said…
Let’s remind ourselves that Viera was French… Henry… French… Pires… Mainly French…
In fact saying Wenger is failing ’cause he’s French makes no sense as he actually also succeeded very well for a period of time with team that was built around some great french players… In fact our greatest footballing period was based on a French Manager with French players….
“Chelsea and Manchester City haven’t suddenly become bigger and wealthier than Arsenal” – erm… they certainly have become wealthier…
Come on…
Cyril, with the money we got for Anelka, amongst the players Wenger brought in around then, we bought some bloke called Thierry Henry – have you heard of him?
And when we sold Overmars and Petit, we got Pires, Wiltord, Lauren and Sol Campbell (Sol on a free but with a massive contract, made possible by the sales).
If the implication is Wenger is not only rubbish now (which he isn’t) but was rubbish in 1999 and 2000 (which he isn’t), please go back and read your Arsenal history: it seems indisputable to me that 1998 to 2005 were the best years for Arsenal since the 1930s. And there is one man to thank for that.
Those same great French players along with the Manager bottled it time and time again in Europe.
26may
You forgot to mention Arsenal didn’t win anything for 3 years between 1999-2002 so the sales did have an impact.
That is why Vieira lambasted Arsenal for being a small club in 2001 and that they were not amongst the top 20 elite clubs in Europe.
Thanks for the post WATA, I am already acquainted with your views on Arsenal and so can appreciate how hard you tried to present a balanced article.
Although I am unhappy with our current performance based on the expectation created by the club itself, I fully acknowledge that the years since building the stadium have been miraculous in the fact that we retained top four considering we had no money and the billionaires that have infiltrated the EPL.
I credit AW as the major driving force behind the great Arsenal sides he tutored in his early years and for being the driving force behind the training ground and the Emirates. The man is a genius and rightly acknowledged as the greatest manager of our modern era.
Latterly, his words have cast a doubt in my mind as to whether he can (or wishes to) adapt his policies to try to compete with the clubs above us at a time when we apparently have substantial funds to invest in the team.
There is so much we don’t know (actually very little we do know) about the machinations of Arsenal’s transfers.
Did AW want Arshavin?
Was it his idea to sign Park?
Is the story true that SAF phoned AW about RvP and was astonished when he agreed to sell him for £23m?
Was Chamakh scouted for 18 months before we signed him? – if yes, sack the bloody scouts 🙂
I could go on. As other have said, I really hope AW writes a warts and all autobiography one day – but I think he’s the kind of man who wouldn’t want to risk damaging the club or other individuals.
Gordon, you’re right that we didn’t win a trophy for three seasons (1998-9, 1999-2000 and 2000-1), though we did of course win the Double in 2002, so your dates are a bit out. But it’s worth remembering that we contrived to hand United a Double in 1999, finishing one point behind them in the league, and throwing away a winning position in the Ryan-Giggs-twirling-his-shirt-celebration FA Cup semifinal at Villa Park, so we were a long way from being a “small club” that season. The following two seasons were absolutely United’s but we managed to get back to the top after that.
I’m surprised the naysayers want to do down our history – usually the critics of Wenger throw his early Arsenal years back in his face, saying he’s past it. But it seems some (who weren’t saying it at the time) now want to reinvent that period as a time of mediocrity.
Rasp, re Chamakh, I was on holiday in the Bordeaux region in the months before he moved there to us, but with it being clear he was going to join us on a Bosman. I drove 100km to see him play, and was genuinely thrilled to see how good he looked – shows what I know! I think he’s just not suited to English football, he should return to France.
World War 2 was, in it’s causes and it’s history, a complex subject which should not be trivialized on a football website. It was in poor taste WATA. I am sure that a cogent argument against Wenger’s style of management can be made without resorting to lazy references to a war in which millions died and suffered. I am sure that you were thoughtless rather than evil. Regarding your discontent with the way the club is being run, I respect your decision to post on this site where you must have been aware that you would be insulted (called stupid etc) as is everyone who is not on his knees to Wenger – so good for you. Lastly, as I have said so many times, The Board have no money invested in Arsenal and are purely decorative. They have no power. All of the power rests with Kroenke who has invested all of that power into Wenger, so insulting the Directors really is a waste of time. Forget The Board – they are irrelevant.
I’ll drive him to the airport 26 😆
Actually I also commented a while ago that Chamakh wasn’t best suited to English football, unfortunately it seems likely he was more interested in maintaining a relatively high salary than furthering his football career at a club that suited his abilities.
Defensive blunders (Wenger’s achilles heel) cost us the Double in 99 and the Cup Final in 2001. Keown’s own goal against Bolton when leading 2-0 cost us the Title in 2003 and the farce in Copenhagen in 2000 was a precursor of things to come.
I did myself an injustice it was 4 years 1998-2002 before Arsenal lifted another Trophy.
Hi Ramgun, I don’t know if you were at the AGM this year, but SK categorically said that the Board make the decisions and run the club.
As a mere supporter I am completely in the dark as to what they actually do, but their ages and history in business do not convince me that they are in tune with the modern world of football.
IG on the other hand has grown in my estimation as his job of running the business side of the club and in doing so representing the wishes of the owner, the board and the manager, at the same time as keeping the supporters and the media happy, would seem to be nigh on impossible.
I was happily going along with you until i was rudely
pulled back by your “french dna”…..in My opinion…
that was uncalled for and terribly racist/xenoph
Why does this article remind me of the “you guys” statement?
What is the “you guys” statement?
Err, Gordon, no: football is played in seasons, not years. We didn’t win a trophy from 1998-9 to 2000-1, three seasons, not four years.
What do the Board do?
It seems to me that above all the Board have to be seen by the fans to get two things right: firstly they have to employ someone to run the football business side and I think by finding the eminently qualified Ivan Gazidis they can tick that box.
And secondly they have to find someone to run the purely football side of things; again, I think they can also tick that box. The fact that David Dein is attributed to bringing in AW is neither here nor there; AW remains an employee of the club and because of that the Board have one less thing to concern themselves with.
After that I think we are into the day to day running of a PLC.
26may
Really 26may i thought the ‘football’ World Cup was played every 4 ‘years’..
WATA
Can’t say I agreed with much of what you wrote but you can see you hold your beliefs dear to you. But why oh why did you feel the need to have a go at the French because your dislike of are French manager.
Fair point, titch, I’ll concede on that one!
Hi everyone, I had no idea my musings were being put up for public examination.
I wasn’t deliberately trying to racially slur or pigeon-hole the French, I was attempting to make the point that in the heat of battle – and football is a battle – the French aren’t the greatest strategists.
Can anyone name any well-known French boxing champions of the last 50 years? That’s the point I was attempting to get across.
They rely on wit and artistery, just like the Three Musketeers, Athos, Porthos and Aramis – or Vieira, Pires and Henry. Sadly, if that fails, the whole thing collapses because there is no alternative Plan B.
Whilst I wouldn’t dispute that Chelsea and MC have more disposable income than Arsenal, I doubt they have the same resources. You won’t see any Marble Halls at either Stamford Bridge or the Etihad, something which sets us apart from any other club.
As for Arsene Wenger, no-one can dispute his impact and what he has achieved at Arsenal, but his player judgement has never been the best, and he has wasted a lot of money on players who don’t deserve to look at an Arsenal shirt, let alone wear one.. He wasn’t laden with success at either Nantes or Monaco, and was sacked by both before going to Japan. And his overall record in Europe is woeful. I think the debate about whether he qualifies as a great manager rests purely with the conscience of the individual, and will rage for years to come amongst the Arsenal faithful.
Thanks to everyone who felt the need to respond, and thanks to Rasp and Peaches for allowing us all to do so.
For those offended, I apologise, but don’t take it too seriously, it is merely a space-filler as we wait for the season to start.
haha – Sniffer Norris is having a field day today under his various pseudonyms (that means ‘false names’, Sniffer).
Stop encouraging him, 26!
By the way, I loved this line of yours earlier in regard to the Suarez possible transfer: “I will hold my nose and applaud the signing.” 😀
So the Board didn’t bring in AW, but they’ve stuck with him.
I seriously doubt they identified IG, my bet would be that SK’s influence was behind that.
How much do they get involved in the day to day running of the club? – very little I’d surmise, we have many people employed to oversee those matters.
Danny Fiszman I know did a huge amount for the club and Ken Friar is a hands on guy, I’m not sure what Lord Harris of Peckham brings to the party and I do hope Sir Chips Keswick is less bumbling than PHW in the way he conducts the AGMs in the future.
WATA
Thankyou for a well written exposition of your take on Arsenal’s current position.
You already know I take issue with the fundamentals of your analysis (your unwillingness to accept the strictures imposed by the new stadium build, coinciding with a world recession and the simultaneous arrival of sugar daddy owners).
However, you have laid out your thoughts in a clear way and everyone can make up their own mind as to what extent they agree or disagree.
By the way, I think people should lighten up about the French thing. I’m sure it was meant (at least partially) in a light hearted way. Yes, the French were heavily defeated in WW2, but they were victorious (along with us) in WW1 and, a century earlier, were militarily unassailable under a certain Napoleon Bonaparte until he over-stretched himself by trying to take on Russia.
If you look back through history, battles between France and England come out pretty much ‘honours even’. It just doesn’t seem that way because when you learn history in English schools you only hear about the English victories (Agincourt, Waterloo, Trafalgar). I assume French kids mostly learn about the French victories (Siege of Orleans, Fontenoy, Carillon etc… not to mention the Battle of Hastings 🙂 ).
RVP with his “you guys” patronising statement to the fans.
Well done, WATA, for coming on and clarifying your intent.
You have also acquiesced to my earlier request to balance your written views with the following;
“As for Arsene Wenger, no-one can dispute his impact and what he has achieved at Arsenal.
His player judgement has never been the best, and he has wasted a lot of money on players who don’t deserve to look at an Arsenal shirt, let alone wear one.”
OK I have slightly edited the statement to ensure the two points are separated and dealt with logically.
Your first sentence would be decried by some, but accepted by the vast majority.
The second sentence is more subjective and judgemental, and you have made no effort to contextualise it.
By inference you are suggesting that other managers like Ferguson, Mourinho and Mancini are better judges of player talent.
Have you considered the one thing that is common to those three, and would also link the managers of Real and Barca too — and that is money?
Best striker in the world? Perhaps Falcao? Cost £55m approx.
Or maybe, Benzema. Likely cost £50m approx.
What about the 3 or 4 players bought by Citeh this summer, including Jovetic et all — very good players — approx cost £100m.
Ronaldo? £85m.
Bale? £100m (maybe).
There is no great science or great judgement to find and buy the best players — it just takes deep pockets.
Wenger has never been in that position — and never will be in my opinion — so to say he is a poor judge of a player when he has been forced to buy in Tesco rather than in Harrods is simply not correct.
I know that brings us to another theme of yours regarding the respective personal wealth of the major Arsenal shareholders — but it is just that — personal wealth, and it is not Arsenal’s.
But best not to go over that all again, I suppose.
Anyway, well done for responding. 🙂
Rocky, 🙂
That was a fascinating glimpse into French history.
Can you tell us more regarding the Kingdom of Burgundy, founded by a whole bunch of Scandinavians, and eventually subsumed into modern day France via the Holy Roman Empire?
I suppose as the Duchy of Burgundy covered such a huge swathe of land, it could have become the principle state and today La Belle France could have been called Big Burgundy and we would probably refer to them as Burgers?
I am sure you will expostulate at my daring to look at an alternative historical association, but I am sure the mix of mes brave Scandinavian, Roman and French stock would not lack in courage! 🙂
Objective article and totally concur with the comments made in relation to the risk policy at the club.
It’s going to take something drastic for the club to realize that it’s prudence policy is now crossing into the anti risk ( thus anti growth) territory. I am not saying that they should go out there and spend like Man City and Chelsea; but our risk appetite does not resemble that of the fourth most valuable club on the planet, that’s for sure.
There is only one person who currently benefits from this approach and that’s the owner who continues to enjoy guaranteed risk-free returns on his investment. You only have to visit the fan blogs of Denver Nuggets, Colorado Avalanche and St Louis Rams to find uncanny resemblances to the concerns we raise. None of these teams have won any silverware since 2001. You can now add us to that list. I question the extent to which sporting success embeds his ambitions and would be very interested to find out as to where we are prioritized amongst the numerous sporting obligations he juggles. How much longer can he continue to hide behind the club’s unorthodox governance structure? until Arsene goes would be my guess.
There are fans who suggest that it would serve his own interest to spend to accumulate. I disagree. Not in this industry anyway. For example, even if we spend all of the £70mill this window round there is still no guarantee that we will the league. If we include the forthcoming CL Revenue of £30mill, then this would leave a deficit of £40mill. If on the other hand we don’t invest the £70mill and still manage to qualify for the CL then we stand to make a definite £30mill and are still in receipt of £70mill funds not invested (£100mill).The comparative difference between the two alternatives in real terms is £140mill.Some may view this example as simplistic, and by all means it is. I have not discounted the potential future cash flows that may arise from shirt sales and sponsorships that may arise from the players bought and resulting TV money, but even then, its clear to see which option represents better risk to return value.
I think it’s imperative to safeguard the long-term future of the club, and this means safeguarding the owner’s investment, of course it does. But it currently feels as though we are operating with the primary objective of delivering the best possible risk to return ratio for our majority shareholder.
I agree with you that there needs to be major changes at board level but the only people that can really change Corperate Governance are the shareholders. We can only presume that Kroenke is happy with the way things are right now. Why wouldn’t he be; he’s quietly made over £230mill on his shares since the acquisition and no one’s bat an eyelid. Quite simply, change will only happen if Kroenke’s wants it to.
Wata – good article, thank you. I am impressed by your knowledge and fact finding; very well thought out piece. Thanks.
I am less impressed by the fact that you think that nothing exciting happened of late at the Arsenal. I think every season has been exciting and especially last was actually too much for me to bear. It is an undeniable fact that we won nothing in the last 8 years, but that to me is a fact, not a huge disappointment. It happened to all greatest footballing clubs and I am sure that our time will come, very soon.
I am sure that the first trophy will be greeted by many with ‘big deal, 1 trophy in 9 years’ or something similar, but personally I want it more than anything else for Wenger; he deserves it and I am sure he will get it.
Thanks once again.
vp – hi, good good comment. Is the figure of £230mil rise in Kroenke’s shares a genuine one? I am gobsmacked if that’s the case
vp,
You have come up with this gobbledegook before, under another name, and I simply cannot see how it is relevant to Arsenal’s spending or lack of it in the transfer market.
The UK Corporate Governance Code sets out standards of good practice in relation to the board leadership and effectiveness, remuneration, accountability and relations with shareholders.
All companies with a Premium Listing of equity shares in the UK are required under the Listing Rules to report on how they have applied the Code in their annual report and accounts.
The main reasons for this Corporate Governance is the protection of internal and external stakeholders (shareholders).
Arsenal have been universally held as a model of financial probity, and as there are only two major shareholders, with Kroenke the majority shareholder who has appointed the management of the company and Usmanov, there is zero chance of any diminution of the shareholders interests.
External stakeholders, debtors, the banks etc are protected under the rules of the Stock Exchange and the over-arching Law of the Land encompassed within the Companies Act and audited every year.
What possible bearing does that have on Transfer Funds, and as WATA has made no pretence of understanding the financial implications of the club, why are you piggy backing your nonsense on his Post.
Answer on a postage stamp, please.
Calling anyone with an opinion …. 😛
We have no posts in waiting, so a few words on an Arsenal related topic of your choosing would be gratefully accepted.
Red Arse – The one name I offer in response is Mario Gomez.
Nice one WATA
I like you as a person and respect your views, but dont agree with a word you negative Git. hahaha
As for he French, your totally wrong there.
I was once involved in a love triangle involving a buxom lady from Chichestor and some French bloke.
The French guy seemed to be winning out, probably because he looked like Sacha Distel..Since he looked like Distel, i decided the only course of action was to beat him up.
As it transpired Sacha happened to be a black belt in some funky martial art, but as blows rained down i could not get that “My Cherie Amour” song out of my mind.and started singing it loudly as he battered me. I think he was singing it to, but i cant be sure.
It was somehow comforting to know that i was been battered by someone with such a sweet voice and from that day forward every time i hear My Cherie Amour, get this lovely tingly feeling. hahaha
Something to amuse: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6KeG_i8CWE8.
Thank you, WATA, 🙂
You are offering Mario Gomez in response to what?
26M, 🙂
The guy next to the coach in the tactics room is surely modelled on Micky!! 🙂
Two questions.
1. Supporting Arsenal, or for that matter any other club, is a conscious decision for a fan. And it is, typically, a long term decision. You stick with the club, in good or bad weather!
In the case of Arsenal, things have (mostly) been good. First, it is (one of) the most profitable football clubs, ever. And here I disagree with WATA, it is profitability (efficiency in generating returns from investments) that matter, much more than size (profits) per se. Second, together with high profitability, Arsenal has delivered CL football consistently over a very long term, together with 2 SFs and a Final. No mean achievement, really. Third, with a distinct style of playing and conducting its business, which has not changed substantially, ven if vthe world around has evolved.
I wonder, what proportion of the fan base would really love a move away from the above model? If we were to splash a lot of money on over-valued players, and perhaps in the process won a few trophies, we would be joining the herd. Right? And become a follower. And give up on a distinct character that perhaps many of us hold dear to our hearts! The distinct character may have some value, right, even if it is not trend setting!
Suppose Arsenal were to suddenly change colours. True, we have no choice but to stick with the decision to “change”, because we are “long term” supporters. But, how many of us would really like the club to join the bandwagon?
2. As many have pointed out, and particularly vp just above, if there is something to complain about, it is probably lack of initiative by SK and the Board. I cannot find myself blaiming AW for this! If at all, one would have to say that Wenger perhaps had a bit too much to do, because of the lack of action (initiative?) by SK and the Board. Well, the ownership has changed recently, and perhaps they should be given more time to stabilise? Even then, I cannot understand the fact that AW appears to take most of the blame? If at all we should pressurise anyone, ask someone to be accountable, it should be the owner and the Board, is it not? Then, the (million-dollar) question is: “who will bell the cat”, and how?
Nice post, arnie.
I seriously think there should be a law requiring that football fans should be able to veto a fundamental change in the home shirt, which is so much a part of a club’s identity. Cardiff shouldn’t just be told by their new owners that the Bluebirds no longer play in blue, and Southampton fans shouldn’t have to put up with no stripes on their shirts.
Not workable, of course, but owners and sponsors take the mick sometimes.
Red Arse – As one of the world’s top strikers who was available this summer for £15m.
Thank you Rocky, evonne and TMHT.
Terry, I thought you knew.
The buxom French Lady in Chichester was me on a Ladies and Tramps night! 🙂
My friend did not know you had a syrup, and thought you had a rat on your head, and when you went into a crouch he thought that the rat was getting the better of you and punched it.
You ducked – he hit you, the syrup flew up and he smacked it back on your head, and so it went on with you ducking and diving and my mate Glic ……………. oops — that was secret — kept on hitting you and laughing.
Oh my — a great night was had by all — except you, and the syrup, maybe. 😀
26May ….. if you’re around, I’d like to take some quotes out of a comment you wrote yesterday to form part of a post …. do I have your permission? 🙂
26May …: Thanks, and I agree. I think the supoorters club should own 10% of the shares, mandatorily. But then again, how do you achieve this?
At 28, Gomez is not a natural Wenger signing, and he wanted to go to Fiorentina for 20m Euros.
Are you suggesting AW should have kidnapped him. Seriously, who is to know whether he will be successful now after so many lengthy injuries, and Wenger would have been ridiculed for going for a cheap has been.
Still not sure what that has to do with anything that I said.
Chelsea, Citeh, Barca, Real, Manure etc had no interest in him, so top quality? I do not think most fans would agree with you.
WATA, sorry my 5:32 was meant for you. 🙂
Excellent, Arnie. 🙂
It is a long time since I heard ‘belling the cat’ and perhaps I could show the fable because you are quite right it does get to the crux of the matter.
“The fable concerns a group of mice who debate plans to nullify the threat of a vicious cat.
One of them proposes placing a bell around its neck, so that they are warned of its approach. Tinkle, tinkle.
The plan is applauded by the others, until one mouse asks who will volunteer to place the bell on the cat.
All of them make excuses.
The story is used to teach the wisdom of evaluating a plan not only on how desirable the outcome would be, but also on how it can be executed, and it provides a moral lesson about the fundamental difference between ideas and their feasibility, and how this affects the value of a given plan.
Aesop?
nice one Arnie! I am a relatively new supporter (25 years out of 54) and was puzzled by constantly repeated phrase the ‘classy club’. I had no idea what it meant in relation to a footballing side. Now I know and hold these values very high; would not swap them for a few trophies. Class is permanent.
And let’s not forget Leeds, Rangers and Pompey. I don’t want to worry that one day Arsenal would cease to exist, it can happen.
Rasp, I’m sure I should say no ( 🙂 ), but sure, go ahead!
I promise it won’t paint you in a bad light 😕 …. thanks 26m
26m – you have an alternative, ie write a fully blown and well overdue post.
…alternatively you could write a post yourself and be in control …. 😀
Arnie, in the real world, it won’t happen but it would be possible for the PL to make it a condition of membership of the league for fans to have certain entrenched rights – share ownership is one (happens a lot in Germany, though it can’t be a rule, since there are a few clubs that don’t maintain a minimum 51% of shares held by the fans); fan reps on the Board; consultation obligations etc.
But as I say, it’s not going to happen, that’s not the way our league is set up.
Anyway, I’m off now, it’s the wedding anniversary and I have to be a good boy.
And evonne and Rasp, I can’t stay up late writing a post (takes me ages, I’m no Rocky) – I refer you to the aforementioned (see, I really am a lawyer) anniversary!
26may1989: hv a good one, mate! And a drink on our behalf as well!!!!
Redders hahaha. It was my fault. Before swinging of handbags i forgot my customary line “Not the hair, Not the hair”
Vey pleased to see you are of the monthly treatment, but a bit shocked to hear you will require treatment for life. Me and the syrup dont usually agree on things but in this case we both forsee a time you will be off the treatment for good.
Terry, 🙂
Rasp 🙂 If I could I would
Many happy returns 26m xx
Rasp
My understanding is that Kroenke is on the Board, do you think otherwise?
what gives you that idea LB 🙂
Hi Evonne
It was just something I assumed, I was hoping that if I was wrong someone would explain why?
If you want a laugh, open the link posted by 26 at 5:12, very funny.
I appreciated the article, some things to agree and disagree with.
— my opinion will be set at the end of this transfer window. Plain and simple. It is up to my beloved Arsene now.
— what i expect is a very good attacker that we desperately need (Suarez i consider world class), and at least one more surprise high quality player in mf. Anything else is bonus.
—–
if we dont add this, i will be more than disappointed, and embarassed.
then i think we may be ready for a change.
— on the positve side, if we do well in adding talent, i will be so excited to see them work with our nucleus of talent, and with some of players coming up, like gnabry and zelalem, we can be at the beginning of something special and long lasting.
— like i said, we will know in a few weeks.
Hi Red Arse
”You have come up with this gobbledegook before, under another name”
I seem to remember a similar reaction from yourself, when I posted a similar comment on Corporate Governance a few months back when I forwarded my concerns about the lack of accountability and transparency that exists at the club. It appears that I have inspired you to read more on the subject and you are absolutely correct with your interpretation of this best practice code. I do not mind one bit that you disagree with what I have posted, but to suggest that I go about posting goobledegook under different names is slightly offensive.
‘’I simply cannot see how it is relevant to Arsenal’s spending or lack of it in the transfer market’’
Who would you say is responsible for the lack of spending in the transfer market. Wenger, Glazadias or perhaps Kroenke?… Could you come up with a definite answer? No… even if you owned 30% of the club you’d still be none the wiser. The fact that our CEO and owner continue to evade being held accountable for player purchasing decisions enables the club to not spend and get away with it, in my opinion.
Rasp
“It seems to me that above all the Board have to be seen by the fans to get two things right: firstly they have to employ someone to run the football business side and I think by finding the eminently qualified Ivan Gazidis they can tick that box.” (LB)
“I seriously doubt they identified IG, my bet would be that SK’s influence was behind that.” (Rasp)
“On 19 September 2008 it was officially announced that Kroenke had joined the Arsenal board of directors.” (Wikipedia)
Hi LB, I believe the Board comprises:
Sir Chips Keswick, Chaiman
Ivan Gazidis, Chief Executive
Ken Friar, Director
Lord Harris of Peckham, Director
Stan Kroenke, Director
http://www.arsenal.com/the-club/corporate-info/the-arsenal-board
Hi Evonne
Yes… the £230mill increase to Kronke’s shares is a reliable estimate, a conservative one if anything.
When Kroenke stated that he “leaves it down to the Board to run the club” I think he was metaphorically excluding himself as he is across the pond and not a great football expert.
Oh I see LB, your point is that if SK was on the Board and he found IG then effectively the Board found IG 🙂
Bingo
Have a good evening.
Rasp
Pity that wasn`t Lord Trotter of Peckham !. This time next year we will be millionaires !………the way we`re saving money on transfers make that Billionaires !. hahaha
vp,
It is possible that I expressed myself a little forcefully, simply because it seemed to be a rehash of something I thought had been put to bed once and for all.
In any event, the controlling owner is Kroenke; the ultimate decision maker on the BoD is Kroenke; the appointer of the CEO, Gazidis, was Kroenke. What is there to misunderstand there?
If Arsenal’s management (including a qualified accountant) calculate that there is a sufficient cash flow surplus to generate a £10m; or a £50m or a £100m investment in players, they will consider among other things the ‘what ifs’.
What if they did not invest in players? Are their other priorities? (Paying off the stadium earlier – for example).
What would the total costs be when salaries, interest and opportunity costs were taken into account?
What if the BoD did invest– what risks would be involved — what benefits would accrue.
The main benefit would be to win trophies, generate more cash/profit from the rewards, generate more sponsorship for a successful team, generate a greater fan ‘capture’ and sell more merchandise, get even more sponsorship from a provable Arsenal fan base which would then attract even more new sponsors, et seq. leading to a higher commercial income and greater profit. A virtuous circle.
The downside would be the players purchased would under perform and lose market value, and the enhanced team would fail to win a trophy.
The BoD would then make a judgement call, authorised by the CEO, with the approval of the Chairman, Sir Chips Keswick – (for many years a member of many financial committees with the Bank of England) and the majority stakeholder, Stan kroenke, either to make the investment or not. They would advise AW of their decision.
This is all basic management techniques.
From all the talk coming out of ‘Pool over the last few weeks, there has already been a substantial bid of £40m made to invest in Suarez, and perhaps in the next few weeks it may transpire there will be additional purchases.
An example of Corporate Governance working as it should.
If you are indeed not the ‘other’ person who raised this elsewhere, then I owe you an apology. That is partly responsible for my exasperation with you, and I apologise for that.
vp – bloody ell, that’s one good profit
” People like to cite his loyalty and love for Arsenal, but my guess is that had he moved to a big club and failed”
Well as we aren’t a big club I’d say we’ve been performing well.
Goodnight
Fantastic news about dandan’s brother and RA’s less frequent appointments.
By the way, “to mount a campaign of bullying” and “heads in the sand positivity from others can also be annoying”. Hmmmmmmmm.
‘’It is possible that I expressed myself a little forcefully, simply because it seemed to be a rehash of something I thought had been put to bed once and for all’’
The club’s Cooperate Governance falls way short of the recommendations prescribed in my opinion and in the opinion of many lobbyists such as the AST ,and most people who have detailed knowledge in this subject area. Anyone who argues otherwise is on a hiding to nothing. Scroll up a few pages to remind yourself of who actually ignited this rehash. I merely touched upon issues raised in the article. And for whatever reason, it appears that you are taking my comments personally.
My reference to revenue generation was based on the Risk to Return relationship .I have no doubt that we could generate more revenue by investing more; my underpinning point is that the risk to return ratio is key to our investor. Particularly as he has a reputation of being risk averse.
VP you are right we can increase our revenue because if we had bigger stars the club could charge more for tickets……hooray!
Sometimes Gooner In Exile, you can take comments a bit too literally.
I’ve never suggested that Arsenal aren’t a big club, that would be a ridiculous thing to say. But we’re not among the elite, the top tier of Barcelona, Real Madrid, Bayern, AC Milan, MU, maybe even Chelsea now. The only thing that will change that is by winning the CL and becoming a major force in Europe.
We aren’t seen as a bigger club than either Liverpool, Ajax, Inter Milan or Dortmund, it is being located in the capital, our history and heritage that has made Arsenal a big world famous football club, not so much it’s haul of trophies. There are big clubs like Arsenal, and there are big clubs who flex their power and prove to the world they’re a big club. Completely different mentalities.
The top tier clubs demand success, Arsenal are in the tier of clubs below who don’t. Even supporters of those clubs display a different mentality. Arsenal fans, like the club, don’t demand success, so are extremely tolerant and generous in their collective expectations, which is why many consider Arsene Wenger to be the club’s best manager ever.
Arsene Wenger has never been challenged at the highest level where a trophy is expected every year, he’s in a job where he’s under no pressure to win anything at all, and being very generously renumerated for doing so. He even has the safety net of knowing that he doesn’t have to challenge the top three, because fourth place guarantees more CL dosh as long as we get through the qualifier. How many years have we been doing the same thing now, with the same broken promises of better things ahead, every summer?
Anyone daring to suggest they haven’t been successful enough are deemed ungrateful urchins who should mind their manners,
although as the top division’s longest serving tennants, it shouldn’t be unreasonable to suggest that Arsenal ought to be the most decorated club too.
I really did not want to appear again today, I would have preferred not to have been associated with today’s post even by appearing on the same page – but I thought this would interest the majority of AAers.
………………………………………………………………………………………………
The draw for the play-off round of the Champions League will take place on Friday, August 9.
Following the second legs of the third qualifying round ties which took place on August 6 & 7, we now know the following:
•Arsenal will be seeded, meaning we cannot face any other seeded team
•Confirmed seeded teams: Arsenal, AC Milan, Schalke, Zenit St Petersburg and Lyon
•Arsenal will face one of the five teams in the unseeded pot
•Confirmed unseeded teams: Real Sociedad, Pacas de Ferreira, Fenerbahce, Metalist Kharkiv and PSV Eindhoven
Haha LB, from this can we conclude that the Board is basically SK and IG with Sir Chips as spokesman, Ken Friar to chair the odd meeting and Lord Harris because his name sounds important 😆
What a wanker Rogers is. He’s been mouthing off about Suarez and Arsenal all summer long – and as soon as Suarez speaks he is “furious” with him.
Hypocritical, dimwit, classless David Brent-alike.
At the present (The past has been archived; The future shall be unfathomable).
Arsenal FC – Traveling Circus (of Entertainment)
Stan Kroenke – Owner who is collecting the $$ at the ticketing booth(s)
Ivan Gazidis – Ringmaster (The PR face of the establishment)
Richard “Dick” Law – The head clown (leads his group in providing the side-show entertainment)
Arsene Wenger – Puppet-master (Pulling the strings / managing his “puppets” at the background)
Players – “Puppets” performing the entertainment on show
Anybody who disagree with the above – The antithesis of JM
{Back and gone with a statement}
Rogers in a wanker.
That’s the way to do it Rocky 🙂
Daily Star reported that Arsenal are preparing a £51mil bid for Suarez. That would make it the largest transfer figure in EPL. I wonder if that would make the unhappy fans change their mind about AW? Would they stop accusing him of being a control freak and scrudge? I doubt it; they’d be saying that it’s too late for that, he should have done that 8 years ago when he had no money to spend. Oh well, cannot make everybody happy
Rasp
Yep, that is about the extent of it; well, that and the small matter of overseeing the day to day running of a PLC with, what, shall we say — 500 million annual turnover. I am sure anyone could do that, probably runs itself really.
Good Morning to any of the Breakfast Club still sipping coffee, like me, before venturing into blogland! 🙂
And behind the BoD are the worker ants — many, many professionals employed by the club in all sorts of disciplines and oodles of legal, financial and stock exchange experts to advise when necessary.
LB is right, Rasper! 🙂
LB@ 7:57, Arsenal has a large number of staff dedicated to the running of a multi million pound business including accountants and lawyers, these are the people who run the club, not Lord Harris of Peckham
Hi Evonne,
I seriously doubt Arsenal would pay out £51m — and I hope they do not.
The newspapers are loving all the headlines, and it is a pity we are being dragged into the mess.
Scrudge? Or do you mean Scrooge? 🙂
OK Redders, just saw your comment.
As with all things, Rasp, definition of ‘running the club’ can mean different things to different people, and needs defining.
Running the club, as in setting out policies and procedures, or agreeing strategy and tactics would be understood to be the province of the BoD under the guidance of Desperate Stan.
While actually ‘running the club’ by implementing those policies etc would be done by the worker ants.
So, you are both right, I guess! 🙂
1:1 dear RA 🙂
you are right – I meant Scrooge 🙂 in polish ‘u’ is pronounced as english ‘oo’ 🙂 i am confused this morning
you are wrong – they will buy Suarez
I’d rather they didn’t pay silly money but this one is out of my hands
Rasp, i am sure you know Lord Harris is not a hereditary peer to make him out as some status symbol Director is unfair, as it is with Sir Chips Keswick.
Both are highly regarded within business world. Maybe they both are getting on in years but that doesn’t mean they are sitting up there wasting away.
GN5, Kelsey, DanDan and JC (scorer of that infamous goal at Highbury) are all of similar age, are they just some kind of status symbol Arsenal fan not to be listened too because bless them they are getting on a bit?
This blog claims to be against name calling and pigeon holing sets of supporters but yesterday we have had a xenophobic statement about the French nation/people in the headline post thankfully our manager is not Jewish or Black as the blog would have gone into meltdown, and you seem intent on rubbishing the age of the board.
Evonne : “I’d rather they didn’t pay silly money but this one is out of my hands”
Thing is its pretty much all out of our hands I guess that’s why I can’t get worked up over it.
Hi all, just a quick note to say I’m off on my hols to Italia, Lake Maggiore to be precise, and I haven’t disappeared into a pit of transfer window induced despair – I’ll save that for the first week of September, ha ha.
Morning all.
I am in a maze of accountants and solicitors on here quite mind boggling. Personally I like to form an opinion on what I see on the pitch together with ever increasing snippets about our proposed transfer targets.
None of us really know how much is in the kitty but if theoretically we are after Suarez at any figure between 40 and 50 million that tells me that AW priority is for a clinical attacker regardless if he stays a year or his history where he may get into trouble yet again and get an even longer ban and of course he misses the first 6 league games, and more importantly none of our current attackers have come up to the required standard he expected.
Just doesn’t make sense to me .
First and foremost we need steel in defence and midfield a Yaya Toure or Michael Essien type of player and a back up keeper. Why didn’t we go for Cesar as Fabianski is shot has one year left and he will be gone to a much lower rank club.We need quality in depth.
So if I am right that would mean spending approx 100 million +. It will never happen,will it.
Hi Charyb,
I love Lake garda and lake Maggiore, both are wonderful!
Can I come with you? 🙂 Anyway enjoy! I know you will.
Is there some blog holiday deal I wasn’t told about? Chary, Micky and Raddy all swanning off to Italy……fine wine fine food…..lucky devils.
Kelsey apparently Cesar is off to Italy on loan. Like you I am worried about blowing our budget on one man.
Hi GIE,
I am oddly pleased that a steady, analytical and cool guy like you can get exasperated and irritated — just like me.
Rare in your case admittedly, but like me I doubt it lasts long. 🙂
Ha Redders/GiE, we’re having an AA meet on Monte Rosa later……ciao !
GIE,
I think Kelsey is suggesting we blow £100m on a bunch of players. 🙂
I just had a 12 year holiday,had enough sun to last a lifetime.:)
LB they shut every bloody road round here last Sunday when you and your mates did the cycle race. Good cause but very inconvenient as the roads were shut from 6.00 a.m. to 7.00 p.m.
Have a nice on chary. I worked in and around Lake Como when i was younger. Absolutely beautiful. Don’t forget your handbag.
No I am not RA can”t you read my simplistic writing 🙂
Lake Como
Wonderful, have a good one Chary.
Calm down GiE, I didn’t mention the age of the board yesterday and certainly wasn’t involved in anything xenophobic or racist in nature
GiE – ditto 🙂
yeah, enjoy it Chary! We will take care of the transfers in your absence. Give my hugs and kisses for Raddy and DidIt
Sorry, Kelsey.
What you actually said was;
“So if I am right that would mean spending approx 100 million +.”
I missed off the ‘+’ 🙂
Rasper,
GIE may have gone to work, but I do not think he was saying you had anything to do with xenophobia or racism, but may have been referring to your 1:34 on BoD age.
I am not sure we always say how much we enjoy someon’e input to the comments on AA, but I for one always look forward to reading yours.
You often speak on topics, and with opinions that resonate with many on here, and you always speak wearing your heart on your sleeve, so where I may sometimes disagree with you, I know it is only a question of degree. 🙂
Rasp says:
August 7, 2013 at 1:34 pm (Edit)
Hi Ramgun, I don’t know if you were at the AGM this year, but SK categorically said that the Board make the decisions and run the club.
As a mere supporter I am completely in the dark as to what they actually do, but their ages and history in business do not convince me that they are in tune with the modern world of football.
Thanks Redders, I’ve read back over my comments, and had forgotten that reference, but I’m general I don’t think I wrote anything derogatory in nature
Thanks GiE, my response to Redders covers my thoughts on the matter
Rasp,
If GIE was here, I am sure he would agree with that. 🙂
It would be no bad thing to have some younger guys on the BoD for the sake of continuity, if nothing else!
Oh, GIE is here! 🙂
Time for me to depart.
Actually Redders, one man I would like to see on the board is also in his seventies – Bob Wilson
Time for a change of emphasis ……..
……. New post ……..
Morning.
Going back to Rocky’s sledging of Rodgers, I feel more than a bit of sympathy with the Nornirishman. Yes, there’s plenty of hypocrisy on his part (look up his own pledges of loyalty to a club shortly before moving to a bigger one, and does anyone seriously think Rodgers or LFC would have backed up one of their mediocre players if he had bit or racially abused an opponent?). But all the playes, including our club, our manager and us, the AFC fans, also come to this with some hypocrisy. But all of the characters in the story, including Suarez, LFC and Rodgers, also have a point.
Why shouldn’t a player be able to pursue his ambitions with a club he feels is commensurate with his abilities, especially when they only have a few years in the sun, and LFC has shown itself to be a long way from being able to realise his ambitions, i.e. CL football? Would any of us seriously compromise ourselves to that extent in our own careers? And yes, I do realise Suarez gets fabulously well paid at Anfield, but the point still holds.
But why shouldn’t his employers also expect their most prized employee to avoid damaging the club’s interests in public? Van Persie did it to us a year ago, and I was mighty peeved about it, because it’s embarrassing, hurtful and calculated to reduce the current club’s negotiating position.
It seems to me AFC have conducted themselves pretty well in all of this. Of course, they have had lots of contact with Suarez’s agent (hence the £40m plus £1 offer), and that is certainly in the grey zone of the rules, But, quite like United last summer, they have studiously avoided really undermining the reluctant seller. If LFC really thought they have a complaint, they should look at their own conduct in relation to their failed efforts at getting Mkhitaryan from Shakhtar Donetsk, earlier in the summer, in which the player forced his move, which was initially to be to Liverpool or Spurs, but ultimately ended up being Dortmund.