Loan Players.

At the weekend Danny Welbeck scored for Sunderland in the wonderful win at Stamford Bridge, not only did he score but he put in a fine performance that had Chelsea’s 2nd string CB’s running all over the pitch allowing others to attack. Fairplay one may say, good on him and good on Sunderland, but Welbeck is signed to Man Utd.

Sunderland first goal was one of the goals of the season scored by  full back Onouha. Onouha is on loan from Man City.

So Chelsea were undone (in part) by players from direct rivals, how can this be?

At Blackburn in our valiant 2-1 victory earlier in the season, Blackburn’s goalscorer was M. Diouf who gave our defence a torrid time. Diouf is on loan from Man Utd.

Last week we played a Wolves team who had Mancienne in their defence, an excellent young player on loan from Chelsea, and we face the prospect of playing Spurs at the weekend who may play Pletikosa in goal – another loanee.

Last season we loaned out young Jack to Bolton and this season we have gained the benefit of his experiences there. Had he scored in a win over MU we would have been delighted !

With the increasing gap between the wealth and quality of squads of the CL clubs and the lower PL clubs, it is inevitable that those players who have a value to the CL clubs but are not within their 25 player squad will be loaned out ( I realise this is simplistic due to the homegrown rules). Furthermore, we have some fantastic young players who will be too old for the youth/reserve teams and not good enough to replace an established player but need experience to develop. That player will go on loan, and he will go on loan to a club in the lower half of the table.

I assume there is an unwritten agreement that loan players do not play against their registered clubs, but why should that be? It weakens the team playing the loanee and therefore gives an added advantage to the loaning team.

I believe there should be an adjunct to the loan rules that stops clubs loaning to teams within the same division, thereby allowing the loanee to get experience  in a first team and does not advantage the loaning club. It did Chesney no harm 🙂

By the way, anyone know who was the last loan player who played in Arsenal’s first team?

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33 Responses to Loan Players.

  1. Big Raddy says:

    A short post prior to the pre-match.

    Be honest, how would we have liked it if loan players belonging to our direct rivals scored 2 goals at the Grove?

  2. SeanyBoy says:

    Waste of time Reading and writing this.

  3. tommystout says:

    My guess would be babtiste.
    Fine post Braddy, its a subject that intrigues me. I thought we had a bit of a secret weapon in LJW last season when bolton were playing our rival, in fact it made me watch the bolton games with interest rather than solely focusing on the arsenal games.

  4. tommystout says:

    loaning because of the 25 man squad rule – i think you have a valid point, and should be outlawed from premiership to premiership, to other countries = fine by me.
    Blooding youngsters however is another matter, too good for the reserves not good enough to make the bench for the first team squad, then what do you do?
    Arsenal need a feeder club or a more competetive league for our reserves to play in, let them in the lower leagues, much like Barcelone B but what happens if promoted, couldnt be allowed.
    Answer – buy a lower league side, can’t do that, FA rules wouldn’t allow it.
    So buy a scottish premier club, would the rules allow that? Not sure.

  5. tommystout says:

    feeder club abroad could be an idea, well its been done already hasn’t it? That however, doesnt benefit us in blooding our players in the harder faster more physical english game.

  6. skwam says:

    just to answer your question, Baptista was the last loan player to feature in our firs team

  7. Wodderz says:

    lol, Baptista had the worst first touch I’ve ever seen from a Brazilian.

    But I completely disagree about the whole, no loaning players to teams in the same division… If you look at the names you mentioned, they are all English players and they need experience in the premiership if they’re gonna make it with their parent clubs (ie. Chelsea, man U, City etc).

    Fair enough, it wouldn’t be nice having them score against you but it is the rules and I think they’re fine.

  8. charybdis1966 says:

    Morning all, I don’t understand what Seanyboy has against that town in West Berkshire.
    However onto the main points of your interesting post Radders, I thought the rule about loanees playing against their loaner club was up to the clubs discretion; I seem to recall Sir Baconface of Whiskeyshire didn’t allow any of his loaned out players to play against the Manks whereas Wenger does.

  9. Carlito11 says:

    I’m not sure how I feel about this topic. I feel that Arsene uses the loan system well and he usually picks clubs that will benefit the players but also make them realise what an amazing club they’ve come from. Sanchez Watt has become a provider of goals up at Leeds and Kyle Bartley has had a regular run at Sheffield United- this has to be a good thing in my selfish view. Mancienne at Wolves is a much weirder one as he’s been there for nigh on 3 seasons now- maybe there should be a maximum loan period before an enforced option to buy?

  10. Carlito11 says:

    I wonder if Seanyboy has anything constructive to offer- perhaps he could direct us to his blog so that we may spend our time wisely!

  11. tommystout says:

    charey if you are still here, i guess you might be a visitor to arseblog and the arsecast… do you not think “Blogs” is tommy vance re-incarnate? 🙂

  12. charybdis1966 says:

    Just to get us in the mood for tomorrow…

    We’ll be running round Tottenham with our willies hanging out, we’ll be running round Tottenham with our willies hanging out, running round Tottenham, running round Tottenham, running round Tottenham with our willies hanging out…singing: WE’VE GOT A FORESKIN, HAVE YOU GOT A FORESKIN ? We’ll be running round Tottenham with our willies hanging out

    The w*nky Tottenham Hotspur went to Rome to see the Pope,
    The w*nky Tottenham Hotspur went to Rome to see the Pope,
    The w*nky Tottenham Hotspur went to Rome to see the Pope,
    And this is what he said
    F*CK OFF.

  13. charybdis1966 says:

    Yeah TommyS, I heard the Arsecast the other week as Tim(from 7am) was a guest on there and it was like listening to TommyV and Lars Ulrich.
    I half expected him to say “Well hello there, it’s Thomas the Vance here on a Friday night…”
    BTW, did you hear my dulcet tones on the 7am podcast on yesterday?

  14. tommystout says:

    i’ll have a listen.its will be good to put a voice to the rants 🙂

  15. Carlito11 says:

    John Terry says he hasn’t been fit for 5 years and is rethinking whether he wants to play through the pain barrier anymore as it may affect his health long term. Best news of the season so far re: title hopes!

  16. charybdis1966 says:

    Hope you have a larf TommyS – but do remember it was unscripted; in hindsight perhaps I should have rehearsed a bit. Oh well.

    Carlito (after the film Carlito’s Way?) it would be nice to think half of the first choice CB pairing is retiring. Now we just need Rooney to self destruct on his return and we are well in there.

  17. dats says:

    Players on loan cannot play against their own club. That is a league ruling – there is no question of any agreement between clubs.

  18. charybdis1966 says:

    Dats, I have a memory of a player loaned out by Arsenal playing against us not so long ago and Wenger saying it was unfair to restrict a loaned out players opportunities to play.
    It was a couple of seasons ago but I can’t remember who it was.

  19. A says:

    It isn’t an unwritten agreement that loan players can’t play against their parent club, it’s very much written and in the rules of the Premier League….

    It was brought in a few years ago.

  20. A says:

    Chary I think it might’ve been Bentley? Or Pennant perhaps?

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  22. charybdis1966 says:

    Hi A, I certainly remember Wenger saying it was unfair and it was why he placed no restriction on loaned on players, I thought it may been Aliadiere ?
    My memory is a little vague on that.

  23. A says:

    I thought he said the opposite chary – in that they shouldn’t play against their own club, because they aren’t going to try as hard against the club paying their wages, or the club paying their wages could put pressure on them to not try as hard etc etc.

    Say it happened to be on the final day of the season, and utd were playing sunderland, with utd needing to win to get champs league for next season. If Wellbeck was through on goal with his expecting to play for Utd the following summer would he really try to score meaning that he wouldn’t be playing in the champs league?!

  24. 26may1989 says:

    Thanks for the two posts BR, you have been busy!

    Dats is right, it’s a Prem League rule (Rule M7) that players loaned between Prem League clubs can’t play against their permanent club.

    Before that rule was introduced, I think a couple of years ago, it was often a condition of the loan that loaned players couldn’t play against their employers. Wenger (in his very principled way) said it wasn’t right, once a player is loaned out, he should be able to play in any game. But now it’s in the rules, so no more debate.

    I think loaning to other Prem League clubs is a good thing, at least for the club loaning the player out, Wilshere being the obvious example of that. The Championship and lower can be ok but the quality of play isn’t always good enough (at least for the more creative outfield players) to make it worthwhile. Loaning to clubs in other countries can be good, but since we’re a club that would loan out more than receive loanees, I would always want us to have maximum options.

    As for loaned players from one big club scoring against other big clubs, that’s just life. There will be more and more loaning of players, and getting the best out of the system is just another thing that clubs both sending players out and receiving them need to do well in order to succeed.

  25. 26may1989 says:

    Sorry I should have said Dats and A are right.

  26. Carlito11 says:

    Chary- Carlito – my favourite film- the diminutive of my name in Spanish- my favourite young gun from last season (but seems to prefer booze and poontang to playing right now)

  27. 26may1989 says:

    Terry will be back. Much as I wish he would disappear to spend more time with his money, every time there’s a suggestion he might have a long term injury, he makes a miraculous recovery.

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