The Corporate Playground

Written by dandan

The football world has changed a great deal over  the Premiership years, with the top clubs in particular becoming a corporate playground, yet I bet there are still many real fans out there, living as I did in Parallel universes attending games in corporate mode, both as guest and host.  Whilst still harbouring the dreams of your youth for your own club and wishing it was they, that were performing before you

I hated the freebee seekers who came not out of allegiance or love of the club or game, but for the ride, the food, drink and a chance to perhaps meet someone famous who was also a guest.

Personally I would only accept invitations if they were to the Arsenal, so as not to deny a real supporter the opportunity to visit his club. Unless as I did sometimes, I had the good fortune to be offered two invites for the clubs my kids supported, those I grabbed with alacrity, allowing them to see how the other half lived and understand how important was the tribal identity in lifting the enjoyment of the game to  its correct level.

The difference between watching an Arsenal match together with your mates and kids, or even  sitting among strangers who are also fellow fans, rather than those corporate parasites who are only “here for the beer, don’t understand the game really” was enough to make this fan sit on his hands less he did someone some damage and probably forfeits his job. I also refused to use group hospitality at the club, taking only clients on their own who I knew were true believers and would want to watch all the game whatever freebees were on offer.

We had tables however both at Birmingham City and in the Magpie room at Newcastle Utd, where I was expected occasionally to play host, but I would only attend personally if the Arse were playing or a major customer was being targeted. Business you see does in the end count.

On the other hand being based in or near London work wise opened up the prospect of evening matches. Is there anything like the colour of floodlit football? These matches I could watch unencumbered by the unseemly corporate flotsam and jetsam described above. But rather with real fans and friends, fortified normally by a large fish and chips collected from the Highbury chippy on the way in.

So today in my retirement when I see the mass of empty corporate seats as the second half kicks off, I feel no regret for times past, but pity not only for the fans that in these straightened times, would in many instances be living a dream to be sat there. But also for the poor souls who are working their butts off trying to get the barflies up and out, so they can get some compensation for giving up the weekend to entertain the self-indulgent bores and at least watch the damn game.

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117 Responses to The Corporate Playground

  1. Red Arse says:

    Morning Dandan, :-)

    Great read.

    It’s writing from the heart based on experience that marks out a really excellent essay!

    I suspect many of us share your antipathy. Many is the time I have shaken someone’s hand and smiled because both manners and business dictated that to be a necessity.

    The difference between that and what you describe, is that I do not need to extend that to my personal life.

    However, corporate ‘entertaining’ at footie grounds, (because it happens at all clubs) is bringing it into your personal sphere of interest, and clearly informs your obvious disgust! :-(

  2. Rasp says:

    Morning …… my comment left on the tail end of yesterday’s post..

    ……Why was Denilson subbed at half time? The answer to that question, like so many, will never be truly known by anyone except AW. Our opinions and what is written by ‘experts’ are pure speculation. The things that are not speculative are the details of the events that have taken place rather than the interpretation of why they happened.

    Denilson was subbed and we looked a better team thereafter. In another game, Denilson may come on and that would be an improvement. Neither side of these debates can ever have access to Arsene’s thoughts, he can only be judged on the effect of his actions/inaction rather than what anyone thinks they know about his motivation.

  3. Rasp says:

    Very interesting post dandan. They used to say ‘look at America to see where we will be in 10 years time’. Apparently they have mixed crowds without segregation and with very little ‘aggressive tribalism’. The corporate freeloaders in football certainly couldn’t be accused of tribalism – more lethargy.

    It all comes down to money (yet again :roll: ) and the naive belief by grass roots fans that they are the most important asset to the club – in terms of revenue they are not. Of course no club would survive without supporters, but the type of supporter is changing whether we like it or not.

  4. mickydidit89 says:

    dandan,
    Your post hits the spot with all real fans. Am I right in saying that Corporate contributes in the region of 1/3 of match day revenue? Or is far more?

  5. mickydidit89 says:

    sorry, or is IT far more?

  6. mickydidit89 says:

    Come come Rasp,
    You know exactly why Denilson was taken off at half time. AW nips in and reads AA, and saw the calls to shuffle the pack and get Nasri central, leaving him the choice of subbing either Ramsey or Denilson :-)

  7. Thanks dandan for the post. I ONCE took my ex to the Emirates because I had tickets in Club Level and he wanted to go and he sat and read the paper!!!!!!!!! He definitely wasn’t interested in watching Arsenal play.

  8. mickydidit89 says:

    Peaches,
    Should the situation arise again, can I be your ex for the day? Thanks.

  9. Shelley says:

    What a load of rubbish. Who gives you the right to determine who is a “real” fan and who isn’t? What constitutes a “real” fan in your book? Am I not a “real” fan because I sit in club level and spend a fortune on my tickets? Does that make me corporate? Can one only be a “real” fan if one earns less than the national average wage? What a load of bollocks. I am from a working class background and have busted my ass to get where I am today. I’m sick of hearing people whine about club level. Not everyone who sits there is corporate. There are plenty of older fans who do not want to have to spend half the match standing up and plenty of fans who were too far down the season ticket waitlist when we moved to Emirates. Look around the ground from 10 minutes before half time to 10 minutes after. There are plenty of empty seats, not just in the “corporate” section. The hypocrisy of some of you so-called “real” fans is unbelievable.

  10. king gooner says:

    let’s face it-the day stadia in the epl went all seater was the death knoll of many grass roots supporters & this was accentuated at the emirates being a new ground,- that any familiarity with fellow “supporteres”went out of the window-we need to bring back at least one qtr of the ground to be standing() as i believe they do in germany )to generate an atmosphere of VOCAL support PLUS a trophy & soon to give our new stadium some history we can relate to-otherwise the corporate johnnies will dominate

  11. mickydidit89 says:

    Just done a little research, and the capacity is made up like this:
    Lower Tier 24,425, Upper Tier 26,646, Club Level 7,139 and Box Level 2,222.
    If the two thousand Box Levelers do contribute a third of match day revenue, then first I would be staggered, and second I would say let them eat their sandwiches!

  12. mickydidit89 says:

    Shelley,
    “There are plenty of empty seats, not just in the “corporate” section.” Very fair point.

  13. gunnern5 says:

    Morning all,

    Rasp I’m not sure about your statement that grass root fans are not the most important “revenue wise”

    Yes the type of supporters are changing but would we fill the Emirates with 60000 corporate freebie seekers? I think not.

    While it’s the corporations that pay the most for their seating it would be interesting to see a break out of expenditures on game days between single seat users and box seats.

    It’s not corporations that are buying our shirts and other paraphernalia each year it’s the grass roots fans who eat, drink and sleep Arsenal. I don’t think that most corporate type’s would be seen dead in an Arsenal shirt.

    In this mans belief teams would falter horribly without a grass roots base, we should also be aware of the club revenue that’s derived from us ‘millions” of overseas supporters.

    As an example my two year old grandson has four Arsenal outfits that family & friends have given him, as they are fully aware who his father and grandfather support. He even has an Arsenal football – already.

  14. Rasp says:

    Hi GN5,

    As you know, I do nopt claim to be a financial expert, but in previous discussions those who do have said that in terms of the revenue streams, TV, merchandising and sponsorship outweigh income from supporters at games …. but you may be right?

  15. gunnern5 says:

    Rasp,

    I was only considering “supporter” revenue contribution.

    I’m not sure they have too much effect on TV / sponsership or advertising income?

  16. mickydidit89 says:

    I think the relevant (to the post) figure would be the contribution of the 2000 Corporate. Anyone?

  17. Rasp says:

    Hi Shelley, only you will know if you are a real fan – the same applies to all of us. My definition of a real fan is someone who has no choice because Arsenal is in their blood. It will mean a mixture of joy and suffering, an addiction as Raddy has called it. It has nothing at all to do with how much money you spend in your support or whether you even go to games.

    As a regular at the Ems, it is an indisputable fact that those in club level are very comfortable and SOME wander back to their seats 5 – 10 minutes after play has started. It doesn’t look good and it suggests to me that their support is more ‘conditional’

  18. mickydidit89 says:

    Shelley,
    I don’t think Club counts as corporate, they are simply more expensive seats. I believe we are talking about the Boxes.

  19. dandan says:

    Shelley.10:15. I think you should read the blog again,I deliberately used the word corporate, at no point did I mention club level. If you pay for your own ticket on club level I say good luck to you, If I attended these days in my advancing years, you can bet your boots I would look for some comfort.
    I climbed the corporate tree from trainee to top man in a multi national so have no hang up with people like you improving their lot.
    I did and still do however resent the so called incentive side of business which is little short of bribery to my mind.
    You have paid for your ticket then enjoy the game and your love affair with the Arsenal you have earned it. For those on a freebie with no Gooner affiliations then my comments stand.

  20. dandan says:

    Hi AA’ers morning to you all.

  21. Big Raddy says:

    My only experience of Corporate was being taken to Spurs. And I can concur with Dandan’s post. I didn’t care and spent much of my time deriding the deluded fools at the Lane.

    Had I been a Spurs fan (perish the thought) I would have been furious at my behaviour.

    Shelley. I suggest you re-read the post.

  22. Rasp says:

    Morning dandan :)

  23. mickydidit89 says:

    My last thoughts on ticket prices.
    Club level at £2,500 a season is NOT expensive.
    Cheapest season at £1,000 IS expensive.
    I hear far more people from Club demanding “rights” about this or that investment in players because they spend so much. Utter rubbish in my book. It is rather like someone paying £100 for a good seat at a West End Show, say Cats, and demanding that so and so ought to be playing Lead Pussy. I would not mind betting that for the majority in Club, their ticket price represents a considerably smaller percentage of their income than for the £1000’ers, who I rarely hear demanding their “rights”. Incidentally, I have nothing against someone buying in Club, but moaning about an extra £50/game for the comfy seat, view and bar falls on deaf ears with me.
    I have stood/sat in every quarter of the gound, from a North Bank Standing season ticket, to Director’s Box, and Corporate, but without doubt, the least enjoyable was in Corporate, so to my mind there is much mileage in what dandan says.

  24. mickydidit89 says:

    Work to be done. I shall return.

  25. gunnern5 says:

    As a fan and sometimes fanatical supporter my emotions run the full spectrum.

    As a supporter;

    I cannot be quiet when people criticize our club or our players. I will always defend and uphold my right to have a differing opinion and question theirs.
    I will always promote the cause or interests of Arsenal above that of other teams.

    But on many occasions (like our current bad run)I’m an emotional nut case and need support myself.

    As a fan:

    I’m overly enthusiastic and excessive in my feelings towards the club and team. My family think that I’m overboard in my admiration and way too intense.
    Many times I’m a frenzied idiot that cannot be spoken to and will not listen to reason – after all why should another person’s reason be more valid than mine?

    How could they possibly know what 73 years of unconditional love for the Arsenal does to ones head?

  26. Rasp says:

    Top comment GN5 – I empathise totally.

  27. dandan says:

    Rasp you dont look 73 mate :-)

  28. Carlito11 says:

    Afternoon all- head deep in work so won’t be around much. DanDan thanks for the post. I just wanted to share this with any fellow stat lovers out there- http://media.photobucket.com/image/recent/hadareud/arse20team20def.png
    It’s from a pay for stats website and was posted to Twitter. It’s the complete stats for our defenders including clean sheets/ duels won/ aerial duels won etc. It makes interesting reading with Sagna the standout defender as I see it from a cursory glance. I think it’s only league stats however and many of the poorer defensive performances have been in cup comps this season. Anyhow, that’s it from me till this evening…

  29. dandan says:

    Gunner 5, When you buy a corporate package seat/table/box it can include many extras. Obviously a programme is generally included, but if you know your clients have children then shirts, hats, ties etc. plus a visit by a celebrity ( Charlie George is a favourite) can be included.
    Once on a trip to Man Utd a watch was included in my sons goody bag, at Newcastle a full tour of the ground was laid on, it depends on the perceived importance of the customers you have invited.
    From the clubs point of view these extras plus the drink ramp the price up of the package and as you can imagine are extremely profitable.

  30. mickydidit89 says:

    dandan
    So you really know how valuable your business is when you get a Key Ring and a packet of Salt and Vinegar!

  31. dandan says:

    Micky sounds like you really scaled the heights :-)

  32. mickydidit89 says:

    How times have changed. Its now cheaper to “persuade” people as to the value of your custom by buying them the pleasures of a lady/man of the night, rather than a day at the Emirates! (I imagine).

  33. gunnern5 says:

    Dandan,

    I don’t mean to underestimate the importance of corporate boxes and the resulting profit.

    My point is more towards the perceived elitist attitude towards the tens of thousands of middle to lower class supporters who attend each game and the millions around the world that also support the club.

  34. gunnern5 says:

    oops I posted the last comment before I intended to…

    You see I’ve also been a member of the privileged few here in Canada and I still sit in box seats at sporting events. However I’m a creature of my upbringing (on Avenell Road) and the ultimate for me was standing at the clock end in any kind of weather -even in short pants, in the winter.

    Because I was amongst fellow hardened Arsenal supporters, who were also there week in and week out, reserve games included.

  35. dandan says:

    Its OK Gunner 5, I was aware of that, was just pointing out how the clubs have the ability to load the packages if they employ marketing professionals to look after clients

  36. dandan says:

    Same for me 5 was always there on the clock end, with my mates and the fish and chips. Sadly I then married and moved to Manchester, so saw loads of away games.

  37. gunnern5 says:

    Dandan:

    I was at the clock end in 50/51 (maybe 51/52) to watch Doug Lishman score three consecutive hat tricks.

  38. Dandan: “Sadly I then married”

    I know the feeling mate :(

    Ps – and thanks for the emotive post.

  39. RockyLives says:

    dandan
    Clearly a heart-felt post, and instinctively I find myself agreeing with the sentiment. And yet…
    I have occasionally been invited to ‘corporates’ at sporting events – Test Match cricket, rugby, horse racing. They are all events I probably would not have gone to without the corporate invitation, but as a sports fan I nevertheless thoroughly enjoyed them all.
    If I got a corporate invitation to a game at the Nou Camp or to an opera or a rock concert (do they do corporates at such things?) I would be equally pleased.
    I suppose what I’m saying is that if a genuine sports fan gets a chance to watch a game at The Grove as part of a corporate do, I don’t really begrudge him/her doing so.
    However, if it’s someone just using up a seat and sitting at the back reading a newspaper or checking their Blackberry all game long, then that’s a waste of a spot that a genuine sports fan would appreciate. It’s also quite rude to the hosts, I would imagine.

  40. RockyLives says:

    Another perspective on this is that I imagine most corporate boxes are rented by people who are Arsenal fans and who are able to put the cost through ‘on the company’ rather than pay for it themselves (I know of one or two who have done this).
    They then have to justify the expense to their business by inviting clients to all the games – in some cases clients who aren’t the slightest bit interested in footy.

  41. RockyLives says:

    Indeed one of the businessmen I know who has a corporate box told me he acquired it for these reasons:
    1) He was going to every game anyway, so why not get his company to pay for it.
    2) By having his company pay the high cost of a box he felt he was financially helping his beloved Arsenal Football Club.
    3) He knew some of his clients were footy fans (not necessarily Arsenal fans) who would really appreciate a day/night out at The Grove.

  42. RockyLives says:

    Whoops – three in a row. Over and out.

  43. Red Arse says:

    Hi Rocky, :-)

    I can understand your business associate’s rationale, but from both the company’s point of view and his, there is a sting in the tail.

    Entertaining expenses are not tax deductible in the UK and the costs have to be added back when calculating the company’s taxable profit.

    There would also be personal tax considerations as the tax man might (will) consider the cost of the box (probably apportioned ?) as a benefit in kind and tax would be payable by the beneficiary (your business acquaintance) on this value.

    That will be £750, please! :-)

  44. Good old P11D’s eh, Red A ?

  45. RockyLives says:

    Thanks Redders
    The chap I know doesn’t own his own company – he just has a sufficiently senior role that he can decide to take out a box at The Grove. So he doesn’t end up paying anything (although, as you say, the company he works for clearly does).

  46. Red Arse says:

    P11D’s CharyB, wat’s dem? :-)

    There are far more intelligent and knowledgeable (although younger) staff than me to handle the mechanics of tax forms. [OK, OK I am just bone lazy] :-)

    I am the twit, at the end of the line, who just works out who pays what to whom and when. :-)

  47. RockyLives says:

    Ah, Redders, then you’re The Gatekeeper! Very important role…

  48. They ued to be fun to fill in around deadline day in my days as an articled clerk RedA.
    The excitement of a life in Chartered Accountancy.

  49. Red Arse says:

    I like that title Rocky. :-) ‘The Gatekeeper’ has a nice ring to it.

    Although being the boss and having smart staff doing all the hard work for you does have its moments! :-)

    Don’t know why I went into consultancy on my own. Doh!

  50. Hi all

    Just popping in to say we have no post for tomorrow unless someone has already volunteered one and I’ve missed the comment :(

  51. dandan says:

    Red Arse. Most companies that do corporate entertaining, pick up the tax tab themselves because if a client goes say to a match and then gets hit at year end for 40% tax. as it was in those days, could be 50% now your orders go out the window.

    Rocky I also had debenture seats at Lords and a box at twickers to play with. Pity I didn’t know Rasp he could have joined my wife and I at lords. Rasp I saw Gooch get his 333 there. :-)

  52. Hi Peachy – I’m sure a post will pop up from somewhere.
    I’m devoid of all inspiration at the moment but if something pops up my end I’ll stick it in drafts.

  53. Rasp says:

    Hi dandan – that would have been good ;)

    I met GG (Graham Gooch not George Graham) a few years ago when he presented my son with the young cricketer of th year award for the Herts and Essex league. He gave a very amusing after dinner speech.

  54. RockyLives says:

    Dandan
    That Gooch innings would have been good to see.

    But I did get to see some world greats over the years, from Gary Sobers to Shane Warne.

    Peaches
    I have an idea for a brief post. Might be rubbish, but I’ll put it in drafts…

  55. Big Raddy says:

    There are Corporate tickets at rock gigs – I have been to hundreds (literally!)

    Cricket. Anyone think we have a prayer against Sri Lanka?

    I am writing a post at the moment Peaches – not sure it is a runner though

  56. dandan says:

    Your son must be a useful player Rasp who is he playing for now in what league?

    If he has half the fun I had out of cricket he will be a lucky Lad,

    Makes me laugh when they talk of 20/20 as a new game we used to play 16 overs a side evening matches all through the summer 40 years ago.

  57. Rasp says:

    Yes dandan, he’s a gifted all round sportsman. He’s playing for a local team this summer as he’s off to uni in Sept to study a sports related degree.

    Raddy, oddly I think we do have a chance against Sri Lanka – but then I always expect Arsenal to win too :(

  58. Radders, I think the Lankans will be tough to beat although for some reason they don’t perform so well at home, possibly due to the weight of expectation of the home crowd – a bit like our beloved Arse in a way I suppose.
    I’ve only managed to blag free tickets to a gig once, it was actually a press pass for a Queensryche gig at the RAH as I had a friend who worked for EMI. A finely crafted performance but not much spirit to be honest.

  59. Big Raddy says:

    CHary. Difficult for a band like Queensryche to create an ambiance in the RAH – strange choice of venue, though I once saw Hendrix play there.

    Perhaps Peaches could write a post on her Emirates experience on Saturday?

  60. What the one with my ex?

  61. Anyway, why am I being put forward to write loads of posts? I did you all a big favour a wrote the match report last weekend ;)

    Only kidding, I’ll write one too :D

  62. Big Raddy says:

    According to BBC John Terry admits that his being England Cpt divides opinion!!

    Divides opinion? Show me one person outside of Capello and deluded Chelsea fans who would give him the Captaincy and I will show you someone who has no conception of what being England Captain means.

    There is a proud history to England Captaincy which requires more than just an ability to lead a football team.

    I am a staunch supporter of the notion of re-habilitation and resurrection, but John Terry has had his chances and thrown them away. From his appalling treatment of Wayne Bridge to his attempting to sell the England Captain’s Wembley Box for profit., Terry has shown an immorality that makes him absolutely ineligible for the Captaincy.

    The England Captain should be a role model, a man that kids want to emulate. When I was a lad I dreamt of leading the England team out at Wembley – it is the highest accolade for an English footballer.

    I accept that there are few players in the England team with the requisites to take the armband.

    I would give it to Theo!

  63. Big Raddy says:

    Peaches. The Szczesny Q & A and the Club Level experience.

  64. Oh right – possible, but not for tomorrow.

  65. Gooner in Exile says:

    Heard a couple of quotes from Szczesney q&a on Yellow Boots On podcast.

    Apparently he was asked whether his tweet re Ashley Coles FA Cup pen flying over the bar was within club policy.

    Apparently he replied “Its within club policy to tweet about average left backs”. :D

    Great post DanDan, sorry been busy working today to join in.

    Will try and get a post into you this week peaches.

  66. Gooner in Exile says:

    Re ticket prices surely they could have reduced the width of the seats in lower tier, increased capacity and reduced ticket prices.

    Comfort and family friendliness was clearly there primary concern.

    As I have said before returning to terraces is a non starter but I would not be opposed to ripping our the seats behind the goals and putting free for all benches in their place.

  67. mickydidit89 says:

    Peaches,
    Are you short of a post. I could come up with something unusual!

  68. Wow micky, something unusual sounds just perfect for the Interlull, thanks, send it through when you’re ready :)

  69. GiE – I was there at the Q and A and he did say that. He was very very funny.

    Thanks for the offer of a post – gratefully received.

  70. Evonne says:

    Peaches, did you read about Jack Wilshere hacking into Szczesny’s Twitter account and announcing that the goalie is gay? I thought that was funny and clever of our Jack

  71. mickydidit89 says:

    Peaches,
    Will be up early as usual and will have something on your desk by 7:30. Alight Miss?

  72. mickydidit89 says:

    Alright Miss! Mind you alight has a ring.

  73. mickydidit89 says:

    Right, off to eat cheese. Helps me to come up with ideas while I sleep.
    Night all.

  74. chas says:

    I’ve only ever sat in the upper tier at our new stadium so know little of the full-on corporate side of the Emirates.

    I think I must have sat or stood in every last part of Highbury. The boxes on the clock end were excellent on the couple of occasions I was lucky enough to be in one.

    Dandan, floodlit football, there’s simply nothing like it. :)

  75. Fantastic micky – I shall be up bright and early to read it. Enjoy the cheese ;)

  76. chas says:

    Micky,
    “It is rather like someone paying £100 for a good seat at a West End Show, say Cats, and demanding that so and so ought to be playing Lead Pussy”. :)

  77. London says:

    More sealions Micky ;)

  78. chas says:

    This is the type of thing I think Micky dreams of after eating cheese.

    http://www.buzzfeed.com/mjs538/50-unexplainable-black-white-photos

  79. Harry says:

    Evening all, interesting read Dandan,

    I understand where your coming from, but to be honest I look passed the corporate cattle and feel more aggreived at the lacklustre support that feels many seats around the grove, but I will restrain myself from going down that road…….I suppose Corporate zombies are a necessary evil…..

    Peaches, I have a post in the process of construction, having laid the foundations, I am in the process of throwing a few ideas into the mix, should be ready for end of the week…….It might be a good sunday thought provoking post with no match to write up on……

  80. SharkeySure says:

    I hear ya DanDan.

    Its the fans who have season tickets that don’t go that really puzzle me. I think Peaches alluded to it the other day, about having spares for non glam games that she could hardly give away.

    I guess some buy a ST as a way of ensuring that they get seats for all of the glamour games, and hope to sell off the non glam games to help reduce the net cost

  81. SharkeySure says:

    Only had a quick scan of the comments whilst listening to Loleatta Holloways ‘Hit & Run’, so apologies if its already been mentioned, but I loosely recall some stat that the middle tier of corporate and club contributed as much of the rest of the stadium on a match day.

    Thats 9,000 seats equalling the revenue of the other 51,000.

    I mention Loleatta as she died today. Hit and Run was an absolute classic way back when. 11mins (!!) of heaven. RIP

  82. kelsey says:

    Good Morning all.

    I have thought long and hard before submitting this comment and have also discussed it with two other regulars on here.I am a founder member of AA, and for the moment circumstances do not allow me to participate as much as I would like to,however I was drawn to a comment which was posted two days ago.

    London says:
    March 21, 2011 at 3:51 pm

    Well, if we could just get Denilson to wear a red and white Star of David on his chest we could really get into some serious collective victimisation.

    To me this is an out and out anti Semetic comment, and having lost two grand parents by being gassed during the war at Belsen and Auschwitz, I am amazed this comment wasn’t deleted.Perhaps I missed the point London, if I have I apologise and wait for your explanation.

    IMO this comment was totally irrelevant to the debate about Denilson, and am amazed it was allowed to be submitted.

  83. Mickeyk says:

    Denilson was taken off because he is useless .why was he even on the pitch in the first place.mourhino for manager wenger out.

  84. chas says:

    I know it’s nothing to do with me, but…..

    Irrelevant and a touch misguided perhaps, but how on earth that comment can be construed as anti-semitic is beyond me.

  85. Evonne says:

    Peaches, Rasp – Mickeyk is Barca Fan in disguise!!

  86. Mickeyk says:

    Get Jimmy rimmer in goal

  87. Evonne says:

    Chas – of course the comment is anti-semitic and inappropriate. I agree with Kelsey – my grandfather was in Aushwitz too and witnessed mass murder of people with the star of David. Families of those murdered were later accussed of falsely claiming victimasation

  88. Mickeyk says:

    Mickeyk is a gooner .just sick of coming second and listening to my kids say arsenal always lose important games .they now excpect us to lose

  89. Evonne says:

    Mickeyk – you are a bad father, you failed to bring your children up properly, as good little Gunners. If I were you I would stop their pocket money immediately, that might teach them :)

  90. Mickeyk says:

    Pocket money what is that . I am to poor to give my children pocket money .I am from holloway

  91. chas says:

    Sorry, still don’t get how it’s anti-semitic. Surely the point was that the persecution of Denilson was wrong, not the other way around. I’ll shut up now.

  92. London says:

    Kelsey

    You are just making yourself look silly, my comment criticises collective victimisation.

  93. Evonne says:

    Chas – why bring the Star of David and victimasation into the frivolous topic in the first place???
    Anyway, it looks like a lovely day in London, just a shame there is no footy to look forward to

  94. Evonne says:

    Sh*t, sh*t, sh*t, I have just realised what I have said – football and Arsenal in particular are never a frivolous topic….what was I thinking of???

  95. Big Raddy says:

    Sunny and about 4°C here. Ideal day for a long cycle tour in the country.

    Saddle Up

  96. Harry says:

    MickeyK, I hear you, it frustrates me as well when we blow an important game and my kids turn and say “we always lose important games” Brum, Barca and United in such close succession is so hard to explain to my boys who really get annoyed……Its probably the only thing about been a gooner I dislike, because I have to listen to my boys, anyone else moaning I can say what I like…..

  97. Evonne says:

    Morning Raddy, much warmer in London and extremely dry, driest March since records began

  98. dandan says:

    London/Chas: anyone with a Jewish background, my wife for example immediately sees that quotation as anti Semitic.
    You might care to call it misguided or inappropriate whatever. But it is an area well steered clear of. Surely if your point was that Deni is being victimised, a stance I actually agree with and abhor. The suggestion that he should wear a target would make your point just as succinctly without the chance of such a misunderstanding in a sensitive area, particularly given the large amount of support we enjoy from the Jewish community.

  99. Big Raddy says:

    Kids moaning about 3 losses? In my day if we moaned we were sent down to the pit for 16 hours hard labour in the dark and damp.

    Kids nowadays don’t know they are born ….

    Morning Evonne and others

  100. kelsey says:

    London,

    I still believe that you are completely out of order and with that I will just leave it.

  101. Evonne says:

    Raddy – yeah, that’s what I call a proper upbringing :)
    A little story about how I became an Arsenal supporter – I came to UK about 30 years ago. The team I was supporting in Poland ceased to exist and I was looking for an English club to support. When my son went to a local school in Highgate, half of the boys were supporting Tottenham and the other half were Gunners. Thank God, whoever She might be, he was hanging around with the nice lot, became a Gunner and dragged me into it. I do love my boy

  102. Morning all

    We have no idea whether London realised or meant his comment to be anti-semitic and apologise that it was left on the blog and has caused offence.

    As dandan says, suggesting that Denilson should wear a ‘target’ would have made the point just as effectively.

    We’ll have a new post very soon so maybe we should count to ten and look forward to talking about Arsenal.

  103. dandan says:

    BR you are the lucky one, I had to clean and dubbin all the boots of my spud brothers cousins and uncles plus our leather T ball, every time we lost, for nothing
    If we won they had to pay me pocket money.
    I learnt the value of money :-)

  104. Raddy – ‘down the pit for 16 hours hard labour in the dark and damp’ The stock-room in Ripple Rd, that was my punishment ;)

  105. Big Raddy says:

    DD. Fortunately in your youth (the 30’s :-D ). We rarely lost.

  106. Big Raddy says:

    Peaches. Those were the days of wine and roses !

  107. Ooooooh deep joy, I’m just sorting the post for today which is a cracker from micky and I’m sorry that you’re going to have to wait to read it but when you do it will make you laugh out loud :lol:

  108. Evonne says:

    Now I understand why you guys are always so positive in face of adversity, especially after losing key games. Given the hardship you all suffered supporting Arsenal in your youth, it is a doddle now

  109. We all made the decision at the start of the blog that if we had a problem within the group we would not air it on the forum.

    This is an Arsenal blog and there is no gain from turning comments into a slagging match.

  110. kelsey says:

    Hold on a minute peaches.

    My initial comment was respectful.It was backed up by two other posters. I don’t need a condescending response saying I am looking for attention .Me swearing was a knee jerk reaction, but you can’t actually blame me.

    The initial comment from two days ago I personally found distasteful, as did others, regardless if it was meant or not.

  111. Rasp says:

    Morning ladies and gents,

    The interlull (copyright Arseblog) is always a time when we supporters go a bit ‘ape’ but that effect has been magnified by the added pressure of our recent disappointments and the fact that we’re still in with a chance of winning the league.

    The usual outcome is that we go off at a tangent which has been spectacularly evident in the last few days thanks to Rocky’s Brazillian safari. The downside is that sometimes we turn on one another ….. please just remember we are all friends united by our genetic arsenalisation.

  112. Mickeyk says:

    How i have suffered watching players like den(ill)son almunia just have a look at almunia what on gods great earth is that man doing at arsenal.denilson was subed in one game because he got to cold and that’s not a joke.they wouldn’t last two minutes in some parts of islington and there ment to be strong when the going gets tough.what’s happened arsenal what the bloody he’ll has gone wrong

  113. Mickeyk says:

    All our problems are over we’ve signed a 15 year old

  114. Mickeyk says:

    Bentners injured let’s hope he never plays for arsenal again but gets better and moves to another club

  115. Thank you for your article I like

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