Goodbye Denilson – written by RockyLives

Written  by RockyLives

In a game of many villains for us it may seem odd to pick out one, but I’m sad to say that Denilson does not belong in the Arsenal first team.

Before I elaborate, it’s worth having a quick word for each of the other villains of the piece (and some heroes):

Alex Song: idiot for the first booking (he was carded for the dissent, not for the non-foul). Idiot for the second booking: when you’re in a minefield you don’t start doing Riverdance. Song knew that another booking would mean red yet he kept making niggly fouls. The obstruction that led to his second yellow would be a booking seven times out of ten. Aside from the bookings, he seemed leaden-footed and went marauding forward on too many occasions leaving us vulnerable in midfield, as if his goal against Bolton has made him think he’s Thierry Henry.

Phil Dowd: many people’s hate figure for allowing the Sunderland goal in the fifth out of four stoppage time minutes. But we all know that the official allocation of extra time is a minimum and anything above that is discretionary. After the flak that the ref in the Everton v Man Utd game took last weekend for blowing the whistle during an Everton attacking move it’s not surprising that refs this week were hyper-sensitive to the issue. Anyway, we’ve benefitted in the past from extra-extra time goals ourselves. If I was going to take issue with Dowd (who was generally pretty good) it would be over the fact that Bramble twice scythed down our players on the edge of the box as they bore down on goal and neither foul produced a card.

Rosicky: he had a good game overall, but the penalty miss makes him a villain. However, even the best players fail to convert pens occasionally and there’s no point dwelling on it.

Jack Wilshere:  London made the point on here yesterday that in the first half he was leaking balls like a pair of torn underpants and perhaps should have been rested after the Braga game. He certainly struggled in the first half, but I thought he played very well in the second and, unlike the more experienced Song, was careful not to incur a second yellow.

Andrei Arshavin: will whoever has pinched his shooting boots please return them immediately to Mr A. Arshavin, Ashburton Grove, London N5. No questions will be asked.

Heroes: although Sunderland played really well and made a few half decent chances, Almunia, Kozzer and Squelchy all played well. Up front, Chamakh put in a tireless shift but in the last 15 perhaps he should have been replaced by Vela. Nasri and Rosicky also had good games overall.

And so to Denilson.

Let me start by saying I’m not a Denilson hater and I don’t like scapegoating players. I was at the Wigan game when so-called fans were booing Eboue and I was not one of them.  I was away at Fulham when a 17-year-old Alex Song was shamefully booed by the traveling support and I did not boo then either.

Two seasons ago I thought Denilson was a promising player, tidy on the ball and efficient with his short passing game. He was far from the finished article but, if he continued to progress, he had the potential to end up being a first team regular. What’s more, he was Brazilian and we all know that Brazilians have an extra bit of brain devoted exclusively to footballing skills (it’s in place of the ‘don’t cut down rain forests’ bit of the brain).

Sadly little Den has not progressed and has, in fact, regressed.  Two seasons ago he seemed able to maintain his focus and work rate.  That’s not the case now. He was rightly condemned for some of his woeful performances last year (being overtaken by the ref during a Man Utd break which led to a goal was a particular low point). Looking at his 37 minutes and 15 seconds yesterday it seems he’s learnt nothing from that criticism. In that relatively short space of time I counted three occasions on which the Sunderland player he was challenging did a give-and-go, and Denilson turned to stand and watch the path of the ball instead of going with his man. It was as if he was a spectator while his opponent raced ahead into dangerous positions. Even Sunday League players know that when the man you’re supposedly marking or closing down gives the ball and runs you’re supposed to go with him. On other occasions when Sunderland won the ball in their own half and attacked at pace, you could see most of the Arsenal players sprinting back to cover – apart from one: there was Denilson, jogging gently back as if it was the end-of-game warm down.

To reluctantly steal a quote from Alan Hansen, it’s as if his football brain is not fully developed; as if his awareness of what to do in crucial situations has gone adrift. I feel sorry for him, I really do. I would love nothing more than to see him turn into a world class midfielder. Elements of his game are still good – his short passing in particular – but it’s not enough. He has become a liability and I have no doubt his inattention will lead directly to us conceding goals this year.

I have a sneaky hope that Arsène knows this too, which is why Denilson has slipped down the pecking order behind Wilshere and Diaby (and no doubt behind Ramsey too when he returns).

I will never boo him, I will never barrack him, and when he turns out for Arsenal I will support him, but I fear the time has come to say goodbye to Denilson.

RockyLives

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187 Responses to Goodbye Denilson – written by RockyLives

  1. Asmo says:

    Stop the scapegoating.

  2. oopsydaisymartinhazy says:

    Is this supposed to be some sort of comedy piece?

  3. Brookesssy says:

    Dowd was awful end of story.

  4. Rasp says:

    Morning,

    Great post Rocky.

    I think the question is: will Denilson (and Bendtner?) be happy playing a bit part in great team or choose regular first team football elsewhere?

    I agree that Denilson has dropped down the pecking order and will start most games on the bench, having said that he is a great sub to have because he can improve our ball retention and calm our play. But Rocky is absolutely correct, he must, must, must track back and work harder to retrieve the ball.

  5. Goonergaz says:

    I can’t argue with any of that, I thought the exact same thing about Denilson. The only thing I would have added is, it would be nice to see Gibbs get a few more games over Clichy this season. Time will tell.

  6. Rasp says:

    Rocky,

    Congratulations on some hilarious lines…

    “when you’re in a minefield you don’t start doing Riverdance” and “leaking balls like a pair of torn underpants” … brilliant ;)

  7. Morning all

    Interesting piece Rocky, I’m sure you’re correct in assuming that Denilson has moved down the pecking order behind Diaby, Jack and Ramsey.

    Who would want him though – thats one of the problems with Arsene persisting with certain players that aren’t good enough, we could be stuck with them for years.

    When Denilson was first elevated to the first team it was as Cesc’s understudy and after that he was given a specific job to do alongside Song – receive the ball and pass to Cesc. When he now comes on as a sub he needs to get into the game quickly and sometimes his awareness lets him down IMO

  8. Francine says:

    Boring! You are like all the muppets in the media who are after Wengers blood! Is scapegoating a new British bloody sport seeing that fox hunting has been outlawed? How many players are you going to remain with if every perceived villain is shown the door. Sunderland was a collective failure. It has nothing to do with what Denilson did or did not do. Your other ‘scapegoater mates’ are sniffing for Clichy’s blood. Others it is Kozzie’s. It is pathetic!

  9. Rasp says:

    Morning Goonergaz and welcome,

    I agree about Clichy, he just doesn’t seem to learn from his mistakes. There is no doubting his desire and loyalty but all too often, he seems to be out of position or guilty of over-elaboration in dangerous situations.

    We should get to see Gibbs play against totnum and hopefully JET will get a chance up front.

  10. charybdis1966 says:

    Interesting observations there RLives, while I’ve never been a fan of Denilson I’m not sure he’s going to be shipped out anytime soon.
    For me he is a symbol of the refusal to replace any of Flamini/Hleb/Diarra during that disastrous transfer window of the summer of 2008 and I could never warm to him. Having said that he has had the odd stand out performance, bizarrely enough one of those was against Barca last season.

  11. London says:

    “We all know that Brazilians have an extra bit of brain devoted exclusively to footballing skills (it’s in place of the ‘don’t cut down rain forests’ bit of the brain).”

    Genius, pure genius.

    Good read Rocky

    You probably already know that I don’t agree, mostly because I still think it is a bit too early to call for his head.

    We will learn a lot more when he plays in the next couple of games in place of Song.

  12. Morning Francine – no-one is baying for Wenger’s blood only making the comment that Denilson doesn’t bring much to the party – if he did, he would be a much better player by now having spent 3 years playing in the Arsenal first team.

  13. Rasp says:

    Francine,

    You are way off the mark. The author is a staunch supporter of Arsène. We don’t succumb to censorship by the ‘thought police’ on here. Rocky, like all our bloggers is pro Arsenal and mature enough to realise that you can debate concerns without being a ‘bad supporter’.

    As usual, all those offended by the article have chosen to attack the author rather than offer an intelligent counterpoint to his view.

  14. kelsey says:

    Morning all.

    Even allowing for injuries,Denilson has made only 63 starts in the Pl in four seasons,and is still only 22.

    By the way has he got a christian name.

    I will call him Stats Denilson, and a certain member of royalty living in the suburbs is a great admirer of his.

    The excellent Tim vickery, the South American BBC correspondant,doesn’t rate him, and in fact when captain of the the Brazil under 19’s (may have been 17’s) he was dropped for the Final in some S.American Cup.

    I agree about the heroes, but as yesterday showed we are divided about Jack.

    It’s Rosicky who needs to put back on his shooting boots.The penalty was dreadful,but where are all those wonderful long range efforts we saw in the World Cup, just prior to him joining us.
    AA will come good,I am absoutely sure.

    nasri has impressed the most this pre season and the first few games.he is beginning to stamp an authority away as well as at home.
    A little hard on Song, arguably our most improved player last season, but he was stupid or too immature to get sent off.

    Look at the back 4.None had ever played together before,and the real disappointment was that especially in the second half, the defence looked as good as it has been for some time.
    The finger has to be pointed at Clichy,if anyone at all. I want Gibbs to challenge him,and I wouldn’t be surprised if Gibbs takes over sooner or later,and perhaps if the rumours that Clichy was wanted abroad that circulated in the summer come to fruition, we have a better prospect.

  15. oopsydaisymartinhazy says:

    Denílson Pereira Neves

  16. kelsey says:

    Look at the back 4.None had ever played together before,and the real disappointment was that especially in the second half, the defence looked as good as it has been for some time… and then to concede at the death.

  17. kelsey says:

    oopsydaisymartinhazy, thank you .

  18. Rasp says:

    Hi kelsey,

    I agree Nasri has been very impressive so far this season, it seems almost impossible for the opposition to dispossess him. The only thing that worries me a bit is that there are shades of Hleb creeping into his play. Often he holds on to the ball too long (although very skillfully) and that can take the momentum out of our attacking play.

  19. futbal says:

    Another biased post.Denilson is not an Essien type of player but he offers us a different edge.The problem with saturday is that AW failed to make a sub to at least change the tempo of the game.I hate it that a team which finished 3rd last season with an average age of less than 25 gets slated by everyone but say liverpool are going through a bad patch when they have spent more than us,but have faired worse.Goooners have to wise up and start gettin behind our team otherwise we ll have ourselves to blame

  20. We’re still getting lots of hits from a Sunderland forum, they are being very complimentary about our supporters, i’ll post the link in case anyone wants to have a look.

  21. futbal says:

    Lets forget about flamini because he was mediocre for 3 years before his last season with arsenal.We need to get behind our team because I for one believe that the supporters mourning makes AW want to prove us wrong which is bad for the team.Denilson is not the best midfielder but even barca do not have 10 ineistas in their team.Some of our players need to show a bit of grit like the kosser and we will be fine.And about Gibbs he is not better than Clichy.If I were AW i will play him in arscavins place when we have a physical team b ecause he leaves clichy exposede so many times.

  22. opiyo vincent says:

    Heroes: although Sunderland played really well and made a few half decent chances, Almunia, Kozzer and Squelchy all played well. Up front, Chamakh put in a tireless shift but in the last 15 perhaps he should have been replaced by Vela. Nasri and Rosicky also had good games overall.

  23. Rasp says:

    Hi futbal, thanks for contributing to the debate.

    The post is an opinion, not a demonstration of bias.

    I hope you understand the ethos of the site. If you would like to send us your view on Denilson and email it (see Contact us above), I promise to publish it (probably on Thursday or Friday), as long as it conforms with the rules of the site.

  24. RedandDread says:

    Hey he might not be the greatest in the world at his position but in the games he has played this season he has looked very good. Intrestingly, he really helped us in ball retention in the last 35 mins without Song and enabled us to grab the bragging rights in midfield even wit only 10 men. The dude looks pure quality to me.

    And in regard to Song, I am sure he will learn to be smarter in certain situations but part of his job is to make those niggly little tackles and break up play. The red card is the danger of his vocation and even then he was a little unfortunate. I mean, Titus Shambles hacked down Wilshere a few mins later and didn’t even receive a yellow card for the tackle.

  25. Rasp says:

    Hi RedandDread,

    Great comment, but surely you have to agree that Denilson needs to show more urgency when he loses the ball.

    I don’t think Song has got back into his stride since the WC. He said in an interview that he wanted to get forward more and score goals, but perhaps AW should have a quiet word and ask him to concentrate on the basics and leave the flamboyancy to others.

  26. vitus says:

    We are lacking spirit, no real fighters eager to win.
    Pity it is

  27. only one says:

    maybe song try to be more like ‘viera’ instead ‘emmanuel petit’..

  28. dandan says:

    morning all glad to see you are all enjoying your football without me. Seems like a roller coaster season ahead for all but Chelsea although they havnt been tested yet.
    Will be in a Spanish bar watching the spud game, will arry put out a proper team against us I wonder.
    Good read Rocky though I suspect I am more of a Denilson fan than you, as for the penalty although I agree pro plasyers do miss they shouldnt miss by that far.

  29. Goonerpower says:

    I thought Denny boy came on and did ok. Quick passing and fairly accurate with them. I’m with London, still too early though. Although that goal from united grated the hell out of me. I work for sky and when I’m in the places with no live link it’s on repeat and see it 20000x a day, he should of tried to run instead of just jogging slowly. All this tells me is that he don’t want to be here anymore. Hope I’m wrong, but fear I’m not.

  30. Rasp says:

    Hi dandan,

    Good to hear from you. How’s the holiday going? – keep splashing on the Factor 30 ;)

    Rocky has allowed the pro-Denilson among us to defend his cause and so in the balance of the comments today, I’d say Denilson has come out quite well.

  31. wise1 says:

    to be very honest with you the writer of this blog has to be a complete idiot.
    denilson may not be the first player on every fans lips but he has to be one of arsenal player we can lose.
    he basically got him for peanuts to wat he is worth.
    this is a player has been captian for brazil youth teams at every level his played at and his will have a big part to play in the furture for the national senior team.
    his arsenal very own darren flecther he works hard, very good at reading the game and also very good technically.
    i was upset he didnt start the game over the weekend because his one of are few players that does not accept be bullied in the midfield no matter who his up against. and thats wat was happening in that game we was being bullied from the start.
    i hate it when fans call out him and bendtner to leave because these are very good players you never see that ddenilson or bendtner is linked with teams like west ham wigan and stoke. they always linked with top 30 from across the continent.

    fans are always quick to say players aint good enough like flamini, song, diaby and now even Koscielny.
    but look how people miss flamini now.
    and i couldnt dream of a team with song. and the french team looks to be based around diaby now. and if Vermaelen had a game like Koscielny did over the weekend fans would be quick to sing songs about him and tell the world how great of a player he is.

    basically if arsene wenger keeps telling the world his players are good enough then please shut up, sit back and listen because at the end of the day uve never been a footballer at this level so you wouldnt know too much about how playing in the premiership

  32. Rasp says:

    wise 1,

    “The writer of this blog has to be a complete idiot” … not a very good start. This is an open blog with writers with a variety of standpoints – do your research before making sweeping statements and cut out the insults.

    You make some good points that reflect your view of Arsenal, please don’t suggest that others who hold different views should just “shut up, sit back and listen” We’re not zombies, we’re passionate and dedicated supporters.

  33. London says:

    I think it is about time we got over that goal against United. If we are going to hold grudges for ever then Almunia should be put against a wall and shot. The reality is that he is doing a great deal to change peoples perspective……..Denilson is more than capable of doing the same.

  34. simon says:

    So one draw prompts this reaction from you. Jees, this site is a joke

  35. Rasp says:

    simon,

    This is getting boring … my comment at 10:06……

    “As usual, all those offended by the article have chosen to attack the author rather than offer an intelligent counterpoint to his view”

  36. Edmond Dantes says:

    I thought that Denilson played reasonably well when he came on. Aw was right to take of AA and repalce him with Denilson. We actually had a good spell after the sending off.

  37. Gooner4life&beyond says:

    Rasp, there are a lot of idiots out there. It’s a shame, but there it is. I also think it’s too early to say goodbye to Denilson, I didn’t see him play, but someone else was raving about him, so let’s wait and see.

    Chelsea just look like they are going to win it this year, but you never know.

  38. Rasp says:

    Hi G4l,

    I agree, Denilson was fine when he came on, but I also agree with Rocky that with Ramsey returning and the competition for midfield places greater than ever, he will be a bit-part player. To that extent it is up to Denilson to decide if that is good for his career. I’d like to keep him because he is a great option to have on the bench and he is still improving.

  39. Flint McCullough says:

    I would remind you that Arsenal do not play “Sunday League Football”, the tactics & fundamentals are quite different. A lot of “Sunday League” mentality on here, I feel.

    It is strange that the only period that we kept any decent possession was when Denilson was on the pitch.

    I don’t think a player without a “football brain” could have been pivital in getting us back in the Barca home game, do you?

    The problem is that Denilson is not a player you can appreciate on tv because a lot of his work is off camera, which can also distort situations that appear to condemn him , eg Stoke – how much ground did he have to make up to get near Fuller?

    Denilson is an excellent young player, who can only get better. At this time if we ever had a full squad available (joke)he may not get in the team all the time but would certainly play his part.

  40. Moe says:

    What really pisses me off, was that instead of keeping the ball in the 93rd minute, he made a stupid blank shot at the sunderland goal. In the last minute of the game, intelligent footballers, when winning by a goal, go to the corner and try to be fouled or win a corner or even a throw in. This was not the case with Denilson. I think that he has not matured along with the others. He should be loaned to one of the northern teams to learn more about the physical game, the time wasting tactics, and the intensive defensing. He has never gone on loan. Look at Wilshere’s defensive attributes. I know he makes the odd mistake from time to time, but how many balls did he intercept in the last 2 games that he played? He is not even the defensive midfielder. He surely learned this at Bolton. None of our players that stayed at Arsenal during their early years ( meaning didnt go on loan) know how to defend. Examples are Diaby, Denilson, etc.. The players who went on loan( Song, and Wilshere) actually know how to defend

  41. Rasp says:

    Hi Moe,

    That is an excellent point. I commented on saturday – where were the 26 passes when we needed them? To try to score in extra time was complete insanity. These guys played when TH14 was with us. I remember him taking the ball into the corner on numerous ocassions in extra time and he had immense ability, its about what’s best for the team not scoring a glory goal.

    The point about going out on loan is also interesting. I think Denilson wasn’t sent out on loan when younger because he was thrown in at the deep end when Hleb, Flamini and Gilberto left and so never got the chance.

  42. Big Raddy says:

    Great read Rocky. Some of the lines had me laughing. Te rainforest one was excellent and of the course the torn underpants….

    As to Denilson. I am in your camp. We will not win the Prem whilst AW picks Denilson. However, it should be pointed out that he would not have played had we not had such a run of MF injuries.

    As you point out the ability to track back is a basic skill for a DM.

    Shame because I like him as a man, he seems committed to Arsenal, humble and happy. He can shoot accurately, retains possession well, and can tackle.

    Perhaps as London says, he needs more time. Some players blossom later than others – just look at Ian Wright. But as has been highlighted, will he be prepared to stay in the knowledge that he is at best 4th choice in his position?

  43. Big Raddy says:

    Here is a link to a piece I wrote back in June. My opinion of Denilson rests in the final paragraph…..

    http://arsenalarsenal.wordpress.com/2010/06/11/samba-de-denilson/

  44. simon says:

    Rasp – ok then. You’re ahving a pop at a 22 yr old after his first game of the season, having had no pre-season.

    The same muppets were having a pop at Fabregas after the blackburn game too. I can’t wait to see your reaction if we actually lose a game.

  45. Good points Moe, I think the collective performance in the last 10 minutes was poor, we looked like we were going to concede. In the same way that we mount attack after attack when we need a goal we must be able to defend a lead too.

  46. Flint McCullough says:

    As I remember it he had carried the ball some distance, whilst surrounded by several Sunderland players, who could have dispossessed him if he had to go further wide. With no other options he created a chance that very nearly went in. What would we have said then?

  47. rockylives says:

    Good day all. I expected to take a few bashings for this piece and many have made good points in defence of Denilson. A couple of comments in response:
    Until moving to America this summer I have been a season ticket holder and have watched Denilson live in most home games, so my opinion is based on watching his all-round play.
    I agree that his good points are very good (his passing) and mentioned this in the piece.
    I just feel his lack of attention and urgency when we lose possession and the opposition are attacking us are a real problem. This problem was apparent for most of last season and was apparent (to me, at least) on Saturday. It will cost us goals and points, as it did last year.

  48. London says:

    Afternoon Flint

    Many of us on here agree with you; for example, I wrote the match report yesterday and argued for pretty much what you said above. But that is the beauty of the site it is a broad church that welcomes the full spectrum of Arsenal support.

    The purpose of this comment it to politely ensure that you are aware of the difference in the opinions of the contributors and the ethos of the site.

    You clearly have strong views, have you noticed the link above that says “Be our guest”, have a look, I for one would love to read your views on any Arsenal subject you choose.

  49. Rasp says:

    Simon,

    I’m not the author. Rocky wrote the piece and is more than capable of defending his viewpoint. I didn’t have a go at Denilson. Please try to keep up.

  50. Rasp says:

    Hi Flint,

    I’d have said he’s a genius :P I wasn’t criticising Denilsons part in conceding the goal and actually commented earlier “he is a great sub to have because he can improve our ball retention and calm our play” but Rocky is 100% right, he needs to work much harder when we’re not in possession.

  51. Rasp says:

    Hi RL,

    Did you like the montage? Its ironic that in the bottom picture of Rosicky’s penalty kick, you can see Denilson sprinting into the box :lol:

  52. rockylives says:

    Hi Rasp – yes, really appreciated the montage. And nice to see Den showing some urgency!

    @Simon: my view would have been the same if we had held on to all three points. I had concerns about aspects of Den’s play last year and, by the way, it was his third appearance of the season, not his first. The worrying aspects of his game still seem to be there even though he took a lot of criticism for them last year.

  53. Rasp says:

    I’m surprised that this piece hasn’t attracted more comment….

    “Shay Given can leave Man City, says Roberto Mancini”

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/eng_prem/9014139.stm

  54. Gooner4life&beyond says:

    Still laughing at the fools who come in to slate the author, offer no opinion and sometimes even slate the wrong person anyway. Lol.

    Look, we probably won’t win anything and I’ll tell you why I think this. Where is our experience? Wherever you look in this team, there is a lack of an old and wise head who will help us to grind out these results. The only one we have is Squillaci and he just got here.

    We are crying out for a midfielder and striker/forward who is going to get the ball, and do the unsightly things that will get us a result, that we may or may not deserve.

  55. Gooner4life&beyond says:

    Rasp, I swear to you I had a dream last night that Given was at Arsenal.

  56. rockylives says:

    BR – I remember reading your piece about Denilson, which put the case for and against very well. I’m inclined to agree with your conclusion, too. That said, if Denilson could iron out the attention lapses no-one would be more pleased than me.

  57. Rasp says:

    Gooner4life&b,

    I’d love to have Given, but you’d have to say that on the evidence of performances so far this season, Almunia is looking a safer bet than Schwarzer.

    On the subject of players redeeming themselves,I thought that two of the most impressive performances this weekend were from Jermaine Pennant and Joey Barton. However, I’d never want their types playing at THoF again.

  58. kelsey says:

    Changing subject, did anyone see Athletico Madrid v Barcelona. What a game .Hard tackling, play acting and more diving than you can se in an Aqua park full of dolphins,and Messi is out with torn ligaments in his ankle. Great game full of passion,would not have looked out of place in our league.

  59. kelsey says:

    Rasp,

    did you see that nice boy Shawcross whack Cole across the upper chest with his elbow in the centre circle,whilst the ball was about 25 yards away.None of the officials saw it.

  60. London says:

    Here is how it works for me.

    Chary made the interesting point this morning: even though he comes from the more sceptical end of the Denilson supporting spectrum he was happy to acknowledge Denilson’s fine contribution in the first leg against Barça. We were, as you remember, closed down quicker and with more determination than any other time that I can remember. So far, I think we should all be in agreement.

    The effect of this was that we were loosing the ball more often than usual and one of the guiltiest was Fàbregas who at first seemed slightly over awed.

    The person who was able to take some kind of control was Denilson: his much maligned short passes were finding their man enabling us to make some head way and move forward.

    Now let’s turn our thoughts to Saturday: what did Sunderland do effectively? Close us down quickly. Who was slightly over awed and kept losing possession? Swap Fàbregas for Wilshere. And whose short passes would have been more effective……exactly.

    To judge Denilson on all his games in the last two seasons is wrong, most of the time he was thrown in due to injuries. When played for his strengths he is effective and a very useful squad member to have.

  61. London says:

    Ohhh Kelsey

    When you are good you are very good.

    “and more diving than you can see in an aqua park full of dolphins”

  62. charybdis1966 says:

    Yeah London, certain players appear as an enigma and I often feel conficted about a number of our squad in that way.
    As with anyone who has the good fortune to wear the blessed red and white I want them to prove me wrong if I have my doubts.

  63. London says:

    Chary

    I have never doubted your desire for any player who wears the glorious red and white to do well………it’s just that sometimes, like you I am sure, we wish some of them would do a bit better ;)

  64. Big Raddy says:

    Well said Chary

  65. kelsey says:

    We all remember Pires when he first joined and even the great TH14.Some had their doubts.Wenger invariably gets it right far more often than he gets it wrong.

  66. Rasp says:

    Hi kelsey,

    Surely the Shawcross incident can be dealt with retrospectively by the FA? It looks like mild mannered Arsène may have to spend some time in the stands following his brutal attack on an official ;)

  67. Actually I was convinced AW was going to get to the stands on saturday – he was being really naughty ;)

  68. Something that they highlighted on MOTD was how El Hadji Diouf targetted Schwarzer when B’burn had a couple of free kicks – he just ran towards him and shoulder barged him to the ground not even looking where the ball was going – Fat Sam must be so proud :roll:

  69. rockylives says:

    That would be the same Fat Sam who is as good a coach as Wenger… (according to himself)

  70. ……thats the one, he’s good enough to coach Real Madrid or Barcelona too don’t you know ……

  71. DKD says:

    I actually have been thinlking of the same damn-thing for 2 years now….i can’t figure it out myself though.

    Cheers,

    http://armourysquare.wordpress.com/

    DKD

  72. charybdis1966 says:

    Just heard from a Hammer, who had the misfortune to have to go to the Shittania on Saturday, a few things that will make you hate Stoke just that bit more.
    You know the bollox-myth about the Stoke fans being the loudest/passionate fans in the Premier League? Well, the cheating snides were playing a tape recording of Stoke fans singing through the p.a. to up the decibel levels – but even with that they couldn’t drown out the Hammers fans.
    At half time they watered the half of the pitch which Stoke were attacking in the second half, so the ball would skid off the surface when they launched their customary long hoofs into the oppo penalty area.
    For the goal Kenwyne Jones had barged into their centre half for the goal(but I’m sure the Stoke troglodytes would be magnanimous if the conceded a goal in that fashion) and we all know about Shawcross’ off the ball shoulder barge on Carlton Cole.
    What a fine collection of “players” and human beings they are.

  73. Sam says:

    It is an amazing piece …the most amazing piece I have read since Saturday’s match!!!!
    Denilson was aweful!!!!well atleast he was 100 times effective than song who ran like a headless chicken for the 60 mins when he was there and when sunderland ran us ragged.
    Kindly see the match again(this time removing your tinted glasses)and see arsenal was best when playing with 10 men and denilson having replaced the wasteful Arshavin (plz drop him fr a game).His positional sense is and has always been better than Song who is much of a traditional DM.Stop Castigating people plzzz and get behind the team..

    Gooner for life!!!!

  74. 26may1989 says:

    Afternoon all.

    I thought RL’s post was great, and I don’t really think anyone can dispute the main point, that Denilson is particularly weak when we’re out of possession. But Saturday’s game does seem a slightly odd game to choose to make the point: as others have said, our game found its rhythm when Denilson came on. He made a crucial contribution to the retention of the ball, which for some reason our other players (other than Rosicky) were struggling with. And if the game had finished at the end of 94 minutes, a battling three points would have been earned, in no small part thanks to Denilson, and despite the quality of Sunderland’s performance in the first 60 minutes.

    But I have to agree with those criticising Denilson for the injury time shot, a very poor decision. He chose to run towards the goal rather than the corner, and that created time for Sunderland to launch that attack. You could see even Wenger was pissed off about that immediately after the shot was taken.

    Final word for some of those who’ve slagged off RL and this site: this is not one of those sites where everyone trades insults, there are plenty of differences of opinion, there’s no need to call people idiots, muppets etc, it doesn’t do anything other than undermine any points you want to make.

    Thank you, I’m off, see you tomorrow.

  75. London says:

    Does anyone know which game Song will be banned for?

    Does the spud game count or does he have to miss an EPL game?

    If it is an EPL game then it will surely be WBA on the weekend and if not needed for that he should play against spuds……just a very small silver lining.

  76. charybdis1966 says:

    London, I’m pretty certain any domestic game is included with relation to bans, so yes Song only misses the Spuds “Cup final” tomorrow.

  77. theres says:

    you’re now on hide mode on newsnow. what a god awful article. you’re an idiot.

  78. SharkeySure says:

    26 May – I’m tempted to repost your comment as my own, as it says everything that I’d say if I had mopre tiom eto thionk about it and then write it…so you’ve saved me a bit of time there.

    RockyL, whilst in overall (slight) disagreement, I must commned you on an excellent piece of prose. That really was a wonderful read, with too many highlights to mention.

  79. rockylives says:

    Thanks Sharkey. I seem to have upset quite a few people, but we’ll see how Denilson does this season. If, as I believe, he continues to play generally quite well but with disastrous lapses in concentration then I suspect others will start doubting his value to the team.
    If he puts his mistakes aside and has a storming season I’ll be delighted to eat my words.

  80. Rasp says:

    OMG what are we going to do? theres has banned us. I’m off to slit my wrists, no-one try to resuscitate me.

    I leave everything to the HFLSWAIOUHD (home for lost souls who are incapable of understanding healthy debate)

  81. James says:

    I have to disagree with the author on this one.Without denilsons blistering pace we wouldn’t have finished 3rd last year.

  82. James says:

    Rasp,I’ve noticed how your calling out for a level of maturity to be observed when commenting….

    OMG what are we going to do? theres has banned us. I’m off to slit my wrists, no-one try to resuscitate me.

    I leave everything to the HFLSWAIOUHD (home for lost souls who are incapable of understanding healthy debate)

    Would you mind eating your own words please?

  83. Arsenal Fan says:

    This article is a disgrace, you say about Eboue and Song but then you write that about Denilson – have a word with yourself.

  84. aaaa says:

    dose any 1 know the arsenal sqaud fro smos nyt please

  85. Rasp says:

    No James I wouldn’t. Do you not recognse irony? Maybe you do because you’ve mentioned Denilson’s blistering pace.

    I’ve had enough of trying to enlighten bloggers who haven’t bothered to spend the time to understand the article or the site. The thrust of the debate has been very positive towards Denilson. If those who are so quick to judge, read through the comments they would see that.

    If you would care to match the names attached to comments from bloggers in support of Denilson against the list of authors, you will find that many who write on here are pro Denilson.

  86. London says:

    aaaa

    It is that last word you used which always works for me.

    Unfortunately, we are all in still in limbo, the squad has not been announced yet.

  87. Rasp says:

    Hi Arsenal Fan,

    The author condemned the booing of Eboue and Song and clearly stated that he would not boo Denilson and would support him as long as he wears the shirt (last paragraph).

    Some fans must really be the footballing equivalent of Mother Teresa if they never have a negative thought about one of our players.

  88. London says:

    Hi Rasp

    I will think twice before sending you and Peaches suggestions by email in future ;)

  89. Joel says:

    I don’t agree with your criticism of Denilson in this particular game. I thought a lot of what he did after coming on was very positive. Coming in away from home and down a man, Denilson did very well to keep hold of the ball and connect many quick, short passes. In fact, we were much better with Denilson in the game than we were without him. He took an ill-advised shot late, but he almost put it in, and he has shown that one of his strengths is an ability to shoot from outside the box.

    I do agree with your criticisms, but they didn’t really cost us anything this weekend. The problem is he cannot play in Song’s role. His lack of concentration and work rate tracking back can be exploited badly when he plays as a holding midfielder. You saw this weekend that even Wilshere played behind him when he came on. I think Wenger has recognized this and that he wont play Denilson in Song’s role this season.

    The problem is who will? Diaby is better further forward. Wilshere and Ramsey also dont have the strength and experience you’d like. Frimpong is out injured for a long period of time.

    It seems we have two staples with Song and Fabregas in midfield and then 10 players fighting for the one spot to play alongside them. We have plenty of cover for Cesc, but none for Song. Thank God Song will be suspended for West Brom and not a week later at the Bridge.

  90. Mariella says:

    Top write. Denilson is Brazilian, all right… He’s a Brazilian bikini wax of a player. ;) Repetitions of “Ow. Ouch. Sunuva…”

  91. London says:

    Now that is what I call a quality comment, Joel have you seen above where it says “Be our guest”, please consider it.

  92. Rasp says:

    Hi London,

    I was going to blame Pat Rice, but now I blame you :lol:

    Its been good sport on here today generally and I’m hopeful that one or two who were scathing might visit again and realise we are not anti anything except ignorance and totnum.

  93. Rasp says:

    That’s an excellent comment Joel, you’ve just restored the yin yang balance on here. Thanks for restoring my faith in bloggers.

  94. London says:

    I like the light hearted ones as well, nice one Mariella.

    “Ow, ouch, sunuva”

    I am going to have to take your word for that ;)

  95. Gooner4life&beyond says:

    Rasp, that is true about Almunia and Schwarzer. However, I think it’s important to note that Almunia is a man with a point to prove, while Schwarzer must be very unhappy to still be with Fulham. There’s no way he can be at his best right now.

    I would have been happy to have him since wenger is still placing faith in Fabianski over the other two keepers, so anything that sees Fabs further down the pecking order would be great for me.

    I like him, but he’s been crap. If anyone needed a loan, it’s Fabianski.

  96. London says:

    “If anyone needed a loan, it’s Fabianski”

    The most accurate thing that has been said on here all day.

  97. Rasp says:

    I agree G4l&b and London,

    The fact that we haven’t found a loan placement for Fabianski suggests to me that AW doesn’t have faith in Mannone and I don’t understand why. Obviously we don’t see him in training day to day, but I still maintain he did pretty well in his 7 game run at the start of last season albeit after a rocky start.

  98. Mariella says:

    This is a good blog. I read it and rate it highly. But some were getting too testosteronic tussle-y. ;)

    I don’t mind Denilson. I just wish he wouldn’t take strolls and stop to smell the flowers– while a game is being played. That he’s young enought to learn is an optimism I prefer to hold on to or a mantra to mutter.

    London, it’s hell and a half. :)

  99. Rasp says:

    Hi Mariella,

    Thanks for adding the feminine touch – I love your use of words.

  100. London – brilliant idea :)

    Rocky – brilliant execution :)

  101. Mariella says:

    Thank you, Rasp. To be fair, even the combative ones are funny. ;)

    The one thing I have learned from being an Arsenal fan is that you have to have a sense of humor. In May, injury barring (improbable) and implosion excepting (possible), once we have our hands on some whatchamacallems?? Silverware? The laughter (looking at the Tiny Totts) will be resounding and sweet and smug.

  102. Nic the Gooner says:

    This is the most idiotic match summary I have read, you make Denilson (a good player) look like Messi

    Time you consider another hobby as football match reports obviously isn’t one of your strengths

  103. Rasp says:

    You’re welcome Mariella.

    Part of the problem is understanding what other bloggers are getting at – take Nic as an example.

    Is he saying Messi isn’t a good player? ..or….
    Is he saying that the author thinks Denilson is comparable to Messi? … neither are true!

    I’d quite like some whatchamacallems this season, and although I expect chelski to run away with the prem title, I have this bizarre premonition of us beating them in the CL final.

  104. Irishgunner says:

    I wrote a comment and it disappeared >:-(

    Ahh well it didn’t say much.

  105. John says:

    wow, what a shit article, kist another scapegoat article

  106. Nic the Gooner says:

    clueless comes to mind but I guess its time for me to go and never to come back as I am wasting my time here

  107. Mariella says:

    I imagine these vitriol spewers getting all choked up in their poison, that it makes them incoherent. I find that funny. :)

    Exactly my foreshadowing too, Rasp! My nose is picking up the fine sourmetalsmell of silverware. And our dear Captain had darned well better do everything in his considerable powers to oblige us. It may make the forthcoming parting a little less bitter, a lot more dulcet. :)

    Night! Good talking. :)

  108. Deepak says:

    Wonderfully written, and I agree about Denilson, I thought he was on the right path when he covered for Fabregas 2 seasons ago, but then he faded away, sad really, but I think loaning him out would be a good option, to see if we can get that Denilson back.

  109. Rasp says:

    Hi Irish,

    Come back, we’ve missed you ;)

  110. London says:

    Nic the gooner

    We have a facilty above that says “Be our guest” we also have a match tomorrow, why don’t you write the match report, send it in and we can all comment the day after. Give it a go.

  111. Rasp says:

    Welcome Deepak,

    Thanks for the comment, not everyone agrees with the sentiment but as you say, it is a great piece of writing.

    The point I keep trying to get across to those who show such disgust at Rocky’s article is that it has given them the opportunity to ‘put the record straight’ with their view – and yet so few take advantage.

  112. Irishgunner says:

    Hiya Rasp

    I’ll try and get on more. These regular working hours are something I must get used to again.

  113. Rasp says:

    Nic, so far we’ve had ‘idiotic’ and ‘clueless’ out of you.

    I’m being serious now, please tell us why you think the article is unfair on Denilson. Others have already put up strong case for him without resorting to name-calling, its not even as though you’ll be in the minority.

  114. Rasp says:

    Hi Irish,

    Have you come to terms with Tomas’ penallty miss yet? I know you’ll forgive him ;)

  115. rockylives says:

    A note to the regulars: thanks for sticking up for my right to vent an opinion, even though I know most of you disagree either a lot or a little with that opinion.

    Wasn’t it Voltaire who said “I disapprove wholeheartedly with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it”?

  116. Irishgunner says:

    I’ll forgive him in a day or two, still a bit mad cos that could have settled the game by all accounts.

    Still, its hard to blame just one.

  117. kelsey says:

    I see Ian Wright is co-commentator tomorrow night .

    London, Song’s one match ban would include the CC which he won’t play in.

  118. London says:

    Rocky

    I think that saying by Voltaire symbolises the day up perfectly.

  119. London says:

    Thanks Kelsey

  120. Irishgunner says:

    Got to go again – will try and be on tomorrow night.

  121. gooner87 says:

    I thought Denilson played really well he came onto the pitch and started keeping the ball, which we werent doing before. He looked assured on it and done well to deal with any danger that came his way, most importantly he kept it simple. I can’t really remember the goal being his fault, it was a header out the and the ball went through several players in our box. It happens i dont think everyone should be so negative yea we had chances to kill the game but equally we were on the back foot for most of it, and it could be seen as a point gained considering how flukey Fabregas’s goal was. Can we please start supporting the team and get behind them. Half of you people are still living in 2004 remember those players were hitting their peak. I think Denilson will be a qaulity player as will alot of the other players and i’ve noticed the progress this year

  122. Rasp says:

    Hi gooner87, thanks for your comment.

    I think the only thing Denilson did wrong on Saturday was to have that shot in extra time – he should have just been trying to kill the game off. It was obvious by Arsène’s reaction on the touchline that he felt the same way. The loss of 2 points cannot be attributed to Denilson and Rocky certainly wasn’t making that allegation in his article.

    We do support the team, that is never in question. It has to be recognised that Denilson will only be a bit part player due to the quality that surrounds him. He will need to improve certain aspects of his game to cement a regular first team slot.

  123. RedandDread says:

    Rasp

    The way we are dropping like flies he may have to be 1st choice. I have no problems with him as you know and like his tidiness and reading of the game. He has no real pace which is an issue.

  124. vince says:

    welcome to my newsnow block list you pathetic hit mongering **** (comment edited by Rasp).

  125. ken says:

    We are entitled to opinions and what comes out clearly is that Denilson is the most discussed player at Arsenal at the moment. There are Pro Den and Anti Den but if we lookly objectively at the path the young Brazillian has gone through then we can atleast that he has stood out to be counted. If it were not the injuries he has suffered in the last season. We could be singing a different song. He was thrown out into the deep end when Flamster left and he had to learn by doing it. What I can point out is that he brings a rare chance especially when ball retention is required. The other observation from all the games Jack the boy has played so far is that he is being played even deeper than Song and the boy has stand out to be counted. He has an excellent technique of moving the ball from deep to the final third. At this I can bet he is the best the club has at the moment. He exactly nows when to make a long pass pass and a short pass. By being played more deep the manager is preparing him for great things and reading the game from deep. It reminds of xavi role at Barca. For me he will always be Cescs partner in the middle of the pack and the third spot should be up for grabs. In Arsene I trust

  126. Rasp says:

    Good point R&D,

    I think his development wasn’t helped by being asked to take such responsibility at a young age when Flamini, Hleb and Gilberto left. Like Cesc, he’ll never have great pace. He has a pretty good eye for goal but as has been said several times already, he needs to show more industry when we don’t have possession.

    I can see how Theo has worked at his game over the summer and he now tracks back more than he once did, Denilson has great technique and steadies the midfield. His much maligned short safe passes were just what we needed when he came on against Sunderland. At the end of the day, we are a club that develops players – you could say that AA and Squillaci are the finished article but in all other cases we buy potential. If Denilson has reached his potential then maybe Rocky is correct, only Denilson can prove him wrong.

  127. Rasp says:

    Welcome ken,

    You’ve made some of the same points as my 8:03 – only better. Good to have your thoughts, I hope we haven’t been added to your block list.

  128. ken says:

    Rasp, Arsenal is the most supported team in our country-Kenya. We love Arsenal and only what the best from the young boys that Wenger has entrusted to fly our colours. And most of the time they have made really proud! How I wish I can be a guest to

  129. Rasp says:

    ken,

    We’re honoured to have your company all the way from Kenya. Tell me, why is it that Arsenal are so well supported over there – and in Africa in general? Does it go back to the days of Kanu?

  130. Evening all

    Sorry I missed you irish and Deepak!!!!! a comment from you, we are honoured.

    Welcome to all our new visitors. We believe all opinions are valid and so please don’t be put off by the tone of the article, if you think Denilson’s talents are underused or that he should be first on the team-sheet then come out and say so. The regulars on the site are fairly split in their appreciation of Denilson so you won’t be alone.

  131. Big Raddy says:

    I love the Voltaire quote and believe we should make it our motto.

    That some stupid people inhabit the net is clearly a truism, we can be grateful that those who try to oppose the rights of a blogger to have an alternative opinion choose to block us. A positive is that once blocked we do not have to read their vitriol.

    Great days blogging today with some excellent comments from both the regulars and many newcomers. Thank you for the entertainment.

    And thank you Rocky for introducing the topic.

  132. Big Raddy says:

    Rasp.

    Africans clearly recognise quality.

  133. Carl says:

    A bit harsh on Denilson i think.
    We were far more composed when he came on, Sunderland hardly saw the ball despite being at home, behind and with a man advantage! Denilson was pivotal in this ball retention. Yes, he shot at goal, but he was surrounded by Sunderland players with not another Arsenal player close, and was in the middle of the pitch…what was he supposed to do? We’ve seen him send them into the top corner from there before, and even if he missed it gave us time to get back into a defensive position!
    I was impressed with him and i’ve been an Arsenal fan for 39 years!

  134. ken says:

    Rasp, I can’t even remember how I started supporting Arsenal. Being 28 and if I can clearly remember the days of Winterburn, Lee Dixon n the great Ian Wright played for us only proves that my support for Arsenal was when I knew a sport called football. But generally we like the entertainment value that Arsenal offers on the pitch and the fact that Wenger has been known for developing very young talented boys has really endeared the gunners to most of us. I am also a big rally enthusiast and I plan to start rallying next year in the 2WD championship and guess what, I will brand my rally car in the colours of our great club. Arsenal forever and a gooner forever

  135. Big Raddy says:

    Carl.

    As you can see from the above comments, there is a pretty even split between those for and anti-Denilson. What we share is that we all support the young man when he wears the red and white.

    p.s. There are those on here who have more than 39 years, myself included, and I would prefer not to see Denilson in the first team. I believe he will have a fine career abroad where the pace is not so frenetic.

  136. Big Raddy says:

    Good on You Ken.

    YOu should write to the club for sponsorship-

  137. Bradley says:

    Hey everybody, just an idea but has anybody apart frm me ever thought that vermalen could be perfect in that holding midfield & lastly i read alot of the time how gibbs should get more games instead of clichy at the moment i would prefer to drop arshavin & play giggs in that more advanced position dose anyone agree ?????

  138. ken says:

    Thanks Big Raddy,and I feel more positive about it. How do I go about doing it? As in whom do I approach for sponsorship/write to. My plan was to start off and once I get publicity which I am great at doing then maybe be most gooners will come on board and maybe the club. Do anyone in England/the UK remember the famous safari rally in Kenya? The sport is still famous here! I am very proud to be a gooner

  139. Big Raddy says:

    Ken.

    I am sorry but I have no idea. I would recommend you go on the club’s website and find the right department, then send them a hard copy letter.

    I wish you the very best of luck.

  140. Big Raddy says:

    Bradley. There was much discussion as to moving TV forward and if I remember correctly AW nixed it.

    I do not believe Gibbs has the finishing ability of AA,.

  141. timba says:

    denilson doesnt cut it anymore.
    i completely agree with this article.
    too many times i’ve seen him wanting with basic defending, positioning, pace.
    i hope wenger sees what is so very apparent for all to see.
    i would be seriously happy if wilshere and rambo (once back) are now ahead of him in the pecking order

    wouldnt be sad to see the back of him.

  142. Bradley says:

    2shay big raddy, but i feel that every team sees our left side as a weakness, & i feel that AA isn’t firing on all cylinders at the mo & gibbs would just give alot more protection to clichy than anyone on the bench, & if gibbs put 1 in every 6 chances away like AA is at the mo i would b alot more happier :-)

  143. Rasp says:

    Hi Bradley,

    I have suggested that TV can play the DM role for Arsenal. He did play in that position for Ajax on occasion. If Song was injured, having kozzer and Squillaci at the back and TV as DM would be a pretty awesome defence

  144. Bradley says:

    Hi Rasp,

    thank u for agreeing, i think it would make an awesome defence, for the first time in a long time, i was buzzing in this weekends game against sunderland i couldn’t wait for them 2 attack i was more interested in seeing how we could cope with the defending side of our game, rather than the attacking side, hahaha what a strange thing to say hey :-)

  145. Big Raddy says:

    If we assume AA is an attacking player thewn the left sided midfielder has a responsibilty to cover Clichy not AA. In most cases Diaby,JW or Mozart.

    Clichy is an important attacking force when Chamakh?AA go inside.

    Rasp. Kolo began as a DM and became a CB just like TV. I believe TV is better placed at CB, he doesn’t have the finesse to be a MF in my opinion. But what do I know?

  146. Rasp says:

    Hi Raddy,

    We’ve had a lively day today, and from what I have read in drafts it could be even more boisterous tomorrow if the auld enemy’s fans get a whiff :?

  147. Bradley says:

    Big Raddy,

    Yep fair comment, but even jw & diaby when playing in the mf automatically get drawn in2 the middle of the park, there just seems to be a gapping hole on the left side & wouldn’t it make sense to play a naturally left footed player on the left side for once ??

  148. Big Raddy says:

    :-D Rasp. Should I temper it?

  149. Rasp says:

    It’s your name at the top Raddy – your choice. I just hope you’re around to fend off the barrage :P

    We could soften the effect by not adding tags relating to ‘them’

  150. Where’s the fun in that, they love to bait us but they’re not that confident :P

  151. Big Raddy says:

    Bradley. Aren’t TR and Diaby lefties?

  152. Big Raddy says:

    No Rasp. The more venom the more I like it !!

    Tag away …..

  153. I heard that Gallas has cramp and won’t feature tomorrow

  154. Bradley says:

    Raddy, yes i stand corrected, but there just not comfortable out on the left, it’s common knowledge there both happier going thru the middle :-)

  155. Raddy – I’m with you, at least dandan won’t be around to moderate me :lol:

    Actually I’ll be fine tomorrow its Wednesday I’ll be a mess …… but amongst friends :D

  156. goonergerry says:

    Why are you attacking the one Arsenal midfield player who showed that he could retain possession under pressure when he came on against Sunderland? Last year Denilson played with chronic abdominal injuries- its not his fault that Arsenal had so many injuries that young players like him were asked to play when unfit.
    Why do you have to slag him off for how he played last year? Do you do the same for Walcott? Please don’t tell me you are not a Denilson hater? Why don’t you give credit when its due?

  157. Bradley says:

    Gerry,

    i feel aw is to blame for alot of the critisism denilson is getting right now, unfortunately, aw seems reluctant in dropping a player when he is under performing, so where u feel strong about defending denilson, we just feel that OTHER players deserve a 2 year chance to prove themselves thats all :-)

  158. Big Raddy says:

    GoonerGerry.

    Read the piece again. There is no mention of hatred, just a honest opinion of Denilson, which I happen to agree with.

    Denilson is at best 4th place DM. As such he is a decent bench player, but can you honestly say you would have him as a first team starter?

  159. Sean says:

    I like Denilson. He is good. Now stop having a go at Arsenal players you “fans”!

  160. Big Raddy says:

    Sean try reading more than the headline. You may enjoy the comments.

    And we are all fans here, why do you think that because someone doesn’t rate a player he is not a fan? Do you think that Rocky who spends most of his time thinking Arsenal (as we all do) is not a fan?

    I am sure you have doubts about players

  161. I’ve just been told i have a spud living down the road – Jake Livermore

  162. irish says:

    It’s only monday but this deserves the ‘bollox award’ for the week. SUPPORT your team not fucking put its players down.

  163. Nick says:

    What can be said? Denilson is coming back after a long period of injury, and has had almost no playing time. Yet, in your casual, unsystematic way, you get to what seems like the only point — 3 times you think you saw a guy run by him. Of course, you don’t talk about the circumstances, and whether he was staying in position, or anything else. And I note that you didn’t talk about other guys running past Arsenal players. That’s the value of casual, pre-selected, opinion-justifying stats: none.

    I’m surprised you didn’t talk about his side- and backwards passing, usually the first line of criticism, even since he showed against Braga how it can end up productive, putting Vela on the off-side line and Cesc in space to score that great goal. Well, even ignoring that example, it might be hard, since of the 19 passes he attempted, he pushed 12 of them forward. And he did it in a third of the game, and completed at a higher rate than the team as a whole.

    Clearances? Denilson had 4; Song had 3, in twice the time — who was better? Jack or Cesc? Sorry, 1 each.

    Tackles? Five in 35 minutes. Better rate and success than Jack or Song. And it’s not like these were throw away minutes — down a man, with the opponent steaming ahead.

    The shots? From in front of goal, maybe 22-25 yards out? yeah, hope you’re not one of those who wish Arsenal would shoot more. You could have said that had he had a little more playing time, he might have made the PK miss irrelevant.

    Interceptions? Two of the team’s 24 in 35 minutes. Song had 2. Jack, in 95 minutes, had just 4.

    Basically, it comes down to this — you have your opinions, but that’s all they are — you watch the game looking for Denilson to be slow, so that’s what you remember. You want Jack to succeed, so you remember when he does — for long parts of the game, he was invisible.

    This is not to slag Jack: he is young, I think he was very tired, maybe more tired than Song, whose poor play I assign to fatigue.

    But, really. No one is perfect on the pitch. Even Cesc, who made just six passes in 29 minutes (vs 19 in 35 for Denilson.)

    I’m sorry Denilson didn’t play the whole game — he would have been fresher than either Jack or Song. He may have dropped in the pecking order with Diaby and Wlishere, though I think Arsene is going to play Jack as much as he can this year with Cesc to speed up his education, not because he is currently the best choice to start in that position.

  164. [...] Goodbye Denilson Written  by RockyLives [...]

  165. anibal says:

    apart from two occacions, i thought denilson was briliant!!

  166. Donald says:

    Denilson indirectly cost us the game-92 mins he made a breakaway noone around him. Anybody with the team at heart would go to the corner flag, win a corner or likely get fouled as he holds it at the corner and see out the rest of the game. Instead he selfishly lets fly and gives possession right back to Sunderland…it was unacceptable and put us in the backfoot.
    He almost allowed a goal by puttin Almunia under needless pressure with a sloppy pass back, and then if that wasn’t enough he got destroyed for pace down the left touchline, anyone else would physically try and slow the player down with a shoulder barge or something, instead he allowed to get beat all ends up for pace and did nothing. Denilson is too soft, and does not have a footballers brain and will not progress.

  167. 26may1989 says:

    The phrase “footballer’s brain” should be banned.

  168. Wolfe says:

    Denilson is a very, very frustrating player.

    His potential (key word!) is fantastic – it’s just a lack of effort at important times during key phases of matches that lets him down.

    In regards to his effort on the pitch, I would categorise him with Arshavin. The two have a similar tendency to try disproportionately hard during certain parts of games and then to take a stroll during others. Sunderland was a good example of this. He came on, put in a series of crisp tackles, tidied up our passing game, and then decided to have a look at the wildlife in the stadium.

    I have no doubt the boy is technically good player, and he has a knack of popping up in stalematey matches to help out (Hull at home and away – the freekick and long distance shot).

    He just simply needs to try harder.

  169. rockylives says:

    Nick – thanks for your comments. I would like to answer a few:
    “3 times you think you saw a guy run by him. Of course, you don’t talk about the circumstances, and whether he was staying in position, or anything else. And I note that you didn’t talk about other guys running past Arsenal players. That’s the value of casual, pre-selected, opinion-justifying stats: none.”
    Well, watch the game again, as I did before posting this piece. Denilson was ball-watching and leaving his man to run into dangerous positions on at least three occasions. If you don’t understand that then I’m afraid your football knowledge is limited. And if you do get it, are you happy with a player neglecting his defensive duties in that way?

    “I’m surprised you didn’t talk about his side- and backwards passing, usually the first line of criticism, even since he showed against Braga how it can end up productive, putting Vela on the off-side line and Cesc in space to score that great goal. Well, even ignoring that example, it might be hard, since of the 19 passes he attempted, he pushed 12 of them forward. And he did it in a third of the game, and completed at a higher rate than the team as a whole.”
    In the article I was at pains to praise his accurate passing, Perhaps you missed it. Try reading it again.

    Your biggest error is to assume that my post was about Saturday’s game. It was not. It was about a player whom I have watched live and on TV in every game he has ever played for us. I think he did lots of things well against Sunderland, but there are certain flaws in his game which will be damaging to us this season in our hunt for trophies.

    Many people have come on here today to defend Denilson and I respect their opinion as I do yours. Mine happens to be different. You cited a raft of statistics which demonstrate that Denilson is good at many aspects of the game. I would not dispute that, but where are the stats on “lost his runner in a dangerous position” or “failed to track back properly when possession was lost”? If you have stats for those I have no doubt that you’ll find Jack and others coming out far better than our Den.

  170. Astamaan says:

    @Rocky
    The only idiot here is you. What a load of crap!!!!

  171. rockylives says:

    Care to elaborate Astamaan? Or have you used up your entire vocabulary already?

  172. rockylives says:

    Guess not. Night night.

  173. rockylives says:

    Guess not.

  174. kelsey says:

    Amazing what a good headline does to generate comments.An excellent day, though I must point out that the headline was a mis print it should have read “Good buy Denilson.”

  175. kelsey says:

    The boss has confirmed that Fabianski is in goal tonight BR.

  176. Big Raddy says:

    That’s good news Kelsey :-D

    Got stuff to do this morning. Hold the fort…..

  177. jeffers says:

    Well written, but rubbish content. This kind of article is like your wife moaning at something you did 4 weeks ago. It’s unnecessary and annoying.

    Here’s why:
    Denilson had a good game when he came on, helped us keep possession when we were down to 10 and was in no way shape or form involved in the goal.

    Denilson is not in or seemingly close to our starting 11. The reason for this: he has faults, we know he has faults, Wenger knows he has faults. Dedicating an article to them is pointless, unless players performance in training and reserve games keeps you up at night.

    The headline. Goodbye Denilson? Says who? Because you have suddenly decided, about a year too late to highlight what Denilson isn’t too good it, does that mean its goodbye. Don’t think so.

    Overall, I feel the article is unnecessary and irrelevant to either the start we have made or the rest of our season.

  178. Rasp says:

    Hi jeffers,

    Thanks for the comment. I think the only reason it may be ‘goodye to Denilson’ would be because he would choose to leave in search of a regular first team berth elsewhere – and who could blame him? His game is probably better suited to continental football. He could become a real star playing in Spain or Italy.

  179. London says:

    Wow, an all through the nighter, I think that was a first.

    If only people had known it was a typo and should have read as Kelsey said “Good Buy Denilson.”

  180. Rasp says:

    Morning London,

    I reckon that if Denilson had read the post and subsequent comments he would have been bouyed by the support he recieved. Those who opposed the view expressed in the post but had the nouse to write an intelligent comment praising Den should feel proud.

  181. London says:

    Morning Rasp

    I want Denilson to do his talking on the pitch, one goal tonight, the winner lets say and he is a hero.

  182. Rasp says:

    New post ……..

  183. Robert SA says:

    i dont think you correct about denilson. If you watch his movement off the ball he is brilliant. He is always moving and taking players away or giving on outlet to the other players. He obviously isnt perfect but who is. As a midfield player myself, even though its just ameatuer i can see the great movement he has off the ball. Maybe pay closer attention to what you watching in future

  184. Rasp says:

    Hi Robert,

    Thanks for your comment. Many on here agree with you and having just seen his performance against totnum, I’d say he has a bright future with us. This is an old post so there is unlikely to be any further discussion attached to this topic – please feel free to join us on today’s ‘gloating’ over the old enemy.

  185. sun readers…

    [...]Goodbye Denilson – written by RockyLives « Arsenal Arsenal[...]…

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